[WikiEN-l] VfD vs. Wikipedia:

[Sam Korn]

I think we have to understand that there are no hard-and-fast rules to
Wikipedia.  IAR applies to every policy and every guideline,
including, confusingly, itself.

Therefore, I don't think we can say "you may never VfD a page in
project space".  Nevertheless, I think it would be almost impossible
to create a case in which policy might be put to a deletion vote. 
Even less one where it would actually succeed!  Any posting of a
policy or guideline that had been ratified by the community would
struggle to be anything other than disrupting Wikipedia (possibly to
make a point).  As such, it would be immediately eligable for a speedy
keep, and I would have no qualms about doing such myself.

As to other pages in the project namespace, I don't think we should
forbid listing them on VfD.  Apart from anything else, they could be
seriously detrimental to the Wikipedia community if something
misleading were put there, when it could not be replaced by something
legitimate.

So, in all, I'd say that VfD'ing project namespace pages is not
forbidden, and shouldn't be, so long as it isn't forbidden by an
existing policy, such as WP:POINT.

Sam/smoddy

On 8/20/05, Essjay -Wikipedia- <essjay-wiki at hotmail.com> wrote:
> (First, hello all, please be patient with me, as this is my first post to
> the mailing list and I'm sure I'll do something wrong in the process.)
> 
> I have a very specific question that I can't seem to find an answer to, and
> it seems that the mailing list is the best way to get a definative answer,
> particularly from our Fearless Leader. Everyone knows that there have been a
> couple of recent VfD's that have created havoc on the site, and have been
> commented on ad nauseam. I don't want to rehash those particular examples,
> rather, I want an answer to this question:
> 
> Is it appropriate for the fate of pages in the Wikipedia: (project)
> namespace to be decided on VfD?
> 
> The deletion policy is vague on the issue. I understand that the recent
> VfD's have involved specific issues that many would consider exeptions to
> policy, but all I want to know is, is it okay for otherwise acceptible pages
> in the project namespace to be VfD'd:
> 
> 1) If I propose a policy in good faith, is it acceptible to disregard
> standard proceedure for gaining consensus and instead list the page on VfD,
> and if it survives, consider it policy, and if it fails, consider it dead?
> 2) If so, can established policies/guidlines be overturned by a VfD. For
> example, WP:BITE.
> 3) Finally, if established policy is subject to VfD, is official policy, for
> example, NPA and NPOV, subject to VfD, and if not, why is it any different
> from other policies that have gained consesus but are deletable under #2?
> 
> My guess is, getting a definative answer on the issue is about as likely as
> finding a flying pig, but I'm putting it out there nonetheless. I'd really
> like to see an answer in the form of: "No, VfD can't touch policy, including
> proposed policy" or "yes, all pages are subject to VfD." Bonus points if the
> header of that response says "From: jwales"
> 
> Thanks all for your patience,
> 
> Essjay
> ---------
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Essjay
> Wikipedia:The Free Encyclopedia
> www.wikipedia.org
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