[WikiEN-l] Turks and Kurds

[Poor, Edmund W]

"Methinks he doth protest too much."

Steve, do I have to talk in surfer slang to get you to chill out for a minute?

Dude! Chill!

I never said "atrocity" could not be neutral. I am just saying that bland titles work better in many cases.

Does Wikipedia have any of the following articles?
* [[Japanese war crimes]] -- not yet, I'd guess
* [[Rape of Nanking]] -- maybe, although it might only be a book review
* [[carpet bombing]] -- should be on the technique, who invented it, and examples of its use, e.g., US in Vietnam

I doubt that even an article called [[atrocity]] would be easy to write, although the _title_ seems neutral enough.

Ya know, I feel I'm being pulled into the Twilight Zone here. What is the actual problem we are trying to solve, Steve?

Uncle Ed

-----Original Message-----
From: Stevertigo [mailto:fofisiks at attibi.com]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 5:32 PM
To: wikien-l at wikipedia.org
Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Turks and Kurds



>Ed:What's not neutral? [[Turks and Kurds]] ? That's as neutral as you can
get. I can't figure out what point of view an article >called "Turks and
Kurds" could possibly express. So I recommend it as neutral. I would also
say that [[Violence against >Kurds]] could be neutral, as well.

[[Turks and Kurds]], eh? Wow, that's *clear... So, expanding on the tone of
[[Turks and Kurds]], perhaps: [[Turk and Kurd relations:From cordial
handshakes to ethnic cleansing]]... Lets say not. *Violence is better - at
least it *says someting.. but its unfitting...

You seem to be saying that the word "atrocity" somehow cannot neutral, that
one's genocide is another's *military campaign.. but I dont buy it.
*Atrocity is as neutral a term you can get. It describes the killing and
torture of human biengs, from the Japanese raping little of girls and
hanging their parents by their tongues in Nanjing, to the use of Palestinian
refugee camps for target practice... its all the same.. The only reason
people feel squeamish in using the term "atrocity" is because they know its
*Not POV: Rather its a term that can be equally applied to everyone... So...
the carpet bombing and napalm-spraying of Vietnam, killing an unknown number
of the 1.6 --- 3.1M VN people killed between '65-'75, could also be called
an "atrocity" - so could the droppings of fatman and littleboy be considered
"atrocities" as well. This is not to say that there wasnt *justification for
each of these... just that the pain and suffering inflicted by human beings
upon other human beings is describable, without any pretext of injustice...
How can the killing of 1M people in any way be *justified? Its beyond the
issue of *justification, just as are the perpetrators are themselves,
moreoften than not, beyond *justice... An atrocity is what it is..
atrocious. -SV



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