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<p>I am also against closing mg:wb, i.e. transferring it to the
incubator. I don't read the outcome of the discussion as a
"unanimous" advice to LangCom to lock the project. There really is
only one strong support for closure, one weak (and very
apologetic!) support and then there's is Jagwar, the only
consistently active user at mg:wb, who sounds more resigned to his
lone stance without support for his efforts. I've looked at the
content, and especially the pages on explaining Python (granted,
seven sections may not make a complete book) are an excellent
example of how to go about WikiBooks in a LWC (language of wider
communication). While I agree that *absence* of content since wiki
creation would be a reason for closure, I don't see *absence* of
content. Those seven sections on Python (I've counted the four
pages of Python/Teny as one section) are content enough for me to
allow mg:wb to continue at its project site.</p>
<p>Cheers,<br>
Oliver<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 15-Apr-18 10:57, Gerard Meijssen
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAO53wxW3QbjFhfaCKhS-us7jcHjPYYZhjvNMyKPm=C7jrEp5=A@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">Hoi,
<div>I am against.</div>
<div>Thanks,</div>
<div> GerardM</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 15 April 2018 at 10:47, MarcoAurelio
<span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:strigiwm@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">strigiwm@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Hello. If I am allowed, I'd like to signal
that the community advices LangCom to lock the project
unanimously in the PCP page, not for inactivity (which
indeed is not a valid reason) but for absence of content
since the wiki creation, which it is a valid reason per
policy to do so. Regards, M.</div>
<div class="HOEnZb">
<div class="h5">
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">2018-04-11 8:22 GMT+02:00
Oliver Stegen <span dir="ltr"><<a
href="mailto:oliver_stegen@sil.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">oliver_stegen@sil.org</a>></span>:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>I'm happy with the action that Steven took,
including the recent re-opening of the
discussion (for clarity's sake). LangCom
appointed him clerk for the kind of activity
which he brings to the table (and for which
LangCom members' activity like mine are too
sporadic to make LangCom effective - see
multiple complaints over the years).</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Closing projects policy was revised after our
May 2011 meeting exactly so that "<span
style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;display:inline!important;float:none">closing
a project is no longer easier than opening
one</span>". In the case of Malagasy
Wikibooks, I vote for rejecting the proposal
to close precisely because inactivity alone is
not a sufficient reason for closure. There's
no harm in keeping it open, and it would be
more work to close it (if I understand matters
correctly).</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>In the hope that this can be re-resolved
quickly (and without yet more bureaucracy),<br>
Oliver<br>
</p>
<div>
<div class="m_4284120631935571393h5">
<p><br>
</p>
<br>
<div
class="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486moz-cite-prefix">On
10-Apr-18 23:14, Steven White wrote:<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div class="m_4284120631935571393h5">
<div
id="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486divtagdefaultwrapper"
style="font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif"
dir="ltr">
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Look,
I'm not trying to make trouble, nor to
ramrod my opinions. With thanks to
members who supported my approach, I
am going to revert the closure of the
discussion. </p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Before
I do that, I will just point out that
I think I have followed the rules up
to this point. Gerard's willingness to
agree to the closure happened in
March, while we were still in a
discussion phase. He did not comment
afterwards, so I wouldn't have
characterized what he did as negating
my proposal. I do think it is within
my purview as clerk to put a proposal
on the table. If I stretched a point
of the rules at all, it was to
hypothesize that a "discussion" during
which only one member comments is not
sufficient to establish a committee
consensus to close an existing
project, particularly when its only
real problem is inactivity. But maybe
that's not correct; that needs to be
discussed.</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">I
would also point out to Marco that per
policy, the community's role in such
matters is advisory, not binding.
Whether or not it should apply to this
particular case, the Board and
LangCom have expressed a general point
of view that they would rather keep
projects open than to close them,
provided that the project is not full
of vandalism. So while the community
does seem to support the closure,
LangCom need not follow the
community's advice, although it
certainly may do so.</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><a
href="https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Closing_projects_policy"
class="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486OWAAutoLink"
id="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486LPlnk254525"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">Closing
projects policy</a> normally does
not involve an actual vote; it is
supposed to close on consensus. Again,
my perspective is that a consensus
discussion to close a project that is
not vandalized requires more than one
voice. If members disagree, then
please say so. (And I'd point out that
frequently we allow a single voice to
mark a project request as "eligible"
or "rejected"; I just think existing
projects deserve a little
stronger benefit of the doubt.) So
let's let this run for at least
another week, to April 17, and see
what else people have to say about it.</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Steven</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<div
id="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486Signature">
<p>Sent from <a
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id="m_4284120631935571393m_4414387168066765486LPNoLP"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">Outlook</a><br>
</p>
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