[Foundation-l] Movement roles letter, Feb 2012

Wed Feb 15 18:53:46 UTC 2012

On 15 feb. 2012, at 19:07, Béria Lima wrote:

> Jan
> 
> Provide me a link to work
> and I will gladly tell on wiki how much your idea
> sucks and how I come up with a better one without dismiss community opinion
> and being condescending like you.
> 

Actually that was not condescending (if anything: sarcasm?)

A good example of condescending would be if you cannot be bothered to address someone by their proper name (say continually calling them Jan instead of Jan-Bart) even when several people have pointed out to you what the correct name is.

Anyway, to end this thread: looking forward to your contributions on the relevant meta pages (for example: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fundraising_and_Funds_Dissemination/draft_Board_resolution)

Jan-Bart

> Here we can't solve anything.
> _____
> *Béria Lima
> 
> **Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> 
> 
> On 15 February 2012 16:01, Jan-bart de Vreede <jdevreede at wikimedia.org>wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 15 feb. 2012, at 18:54, Béria Lima wrote:
>> 
>>> Jan for the million time: Give me the parameters and we can discuss. I
>> will
>>> not put my faith in another
>>> "great-and-solver-of-all-Wikimedians-problems-but-not-yet-funded"
>> Committe.
>> 
>> Ok, in that case, just wait until we have all solved this without you...
>> 
>>> 
>>> When you have a clear way to choose people for this FDC, a clear way of
>> how
>>> it will going to work and most important: How much real power they will
>>> have we can talk.
>> 
>> Ok, it might be too late for you to influence it at that point
>> 
>>> 
>>> Until there, is just you and me talking about philosophical situations.
>> We
>>> can spend all day here, but isn't going to come to any result until we
>> have
>>> the data.
>> 
>> Lets all come up with the best solution, we will refine it over de coming
>> years and send you the data around 2015 :)
>> 
>>> 
>>> ... And quite frankly I have too much thing to do to engage in any
>>> meaningless talk.
>>> _____
>> 
>> I hate to say this: but you are doing quite well on the meaningless
>> talk... (counting all your contributions to this topic on both internal and
>> foundation).
>> 
>> Yes: I am being confrontational (which I almost never am). EIther help
>> think of something that will make this work or stop repeating that it will
>> never work (because I get it, I really heard you the first X times)
>> 
>> Jan-Bart
>> 
>> 
>>> *Béria Lima*
>>> *
>>> Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
>> livre
>>> acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir
>>> esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 15 February 2012 15:34, Jan-bart de Vreede <jdevreede at wikimedia.org
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> this would be called: too much drama
>>>> 
>>>> There is no life and death situation for "the chapters here". See my
>>>> earlier mails for ways of getting to a sustainable organization...
>>>> 
>>>> Secondly: When faced with a  life or death situation, most people try to
>>>> trick death and stay alive.. most don't repeat: "I am going to die" for
>>>> weeks on end.
>>>> 
>>>> In short: Come up with conditions that can make this work for you, try
>> to
>>>> think in opportunities rather that not think at all.
>>>> 
>>>> Jan-Bart
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 15 feb. 2012, at 14:47, Béria Lima wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Serious that you can't see the good side in ask the chapters, Bishakha?
>>>>> You're after all deciding their lifes or death, can't we at least
>> choose
>>>>> the way we are going to die?
>>>>> _____
>>>>> *Béria Lima*
>>>>> 
>>>>> *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
>>>>> livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
>>>>> construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 15 February 2012 05:30, Bishakha Datta <bishakhadatta at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 7:18 PM, Ziko van Dijk <
>> vandijk at wmnederland.nl
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 2012/2/14 Jan-Bart de Vreede <jdevreede at wikimedia.org>:
>>>>>>>> It is clear to me that there is a close link between the
>>>>>>> fundraising/dissemination discussion and the increased options of
>>>>>>> "organising" ourselves. I am also convinced that we
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Indeed, and it may not be a coincidence that these two letters came
>>>>>>> out more or less at the same time. :-) I find it good that the WMF
>>>>>>> board is taking up these discussions and opens them again.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> How about asking the *official* opinion of the chapters, within a
>>>>>>> certain time frame (e.g. 1 or 2 months)?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Meaning? I continue to think it would be great if we had a wide range
>> of
>>>>>> opinion on this - both from chapters and from others in the movement.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Because the MR process has gone on for so long, I'm personally
>>>> sceptical of
>>>>>> extending the deadline. (I'm not convinced we will actually get more
>>>>>> discussion with more time - that has not necessarily been the history
>>>> of MR
>>>>>> since 2010 July, when it began.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> So at this moment, I'm leaning towards a one-month focused period of
>>>>>> discussion.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Best
>>>>>> Bishakha
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Then we would have a more
>>>>>>> substantial and reliable feedback, compared to the mails on a
>>>>>>> mailinglist or talk page comments, all done by people as individuals.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>> Ziko
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> Vereniging Wikimedia Nederland
>>>>>>> dr. Ziko van Dijk, voorzitter
>>>>>>> http://wmnederland.nl/
>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> 
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