[Foundation-l] 86% of german users disagree with the introduction of the personal image filter

[Tobias Oelgarte]

Am 16.09.2011 19:13, schrieb Milos Rancic:

> * There is significant disproportion in position between editors with
> a couple of edits and the core of the community.
That still has to be proven. I asked for localized (project based) data 
from the poll to inspect if there are huge cultural differences or if 
there is a general bias towards the filter. This was more then two weeks 
ago and i reminded Philippe repeatedly to release this data. So far 
nothing was released and one excuse followed the other. Thats why i 
can't support or oppose your statement. But assuming that it would be 
true would be as false as to say that it is false.

So i repeat my request again: "Philippe, can you hear me? Release the 
data as soon as possible, we need it".

> * It's not likely that it would be ~85% against, but similar pool on
> English Wikipedia would likely finish with ~60% against. Hypothetical
> referendums on projects in many European languages would finish
> similarly to the referendum on German Wikipedia, as in this case
> macho-patriarchal culture, dominant in large parts of Europe,
> corresponds with libertarian positions, dominant among the core
> editors.
You would have to proof that your facts are indeed true. But if you 
accept it as a huge difference between cultures, how can you impose a 
filter for a culture that doesn't need it or wants it?

How would you expect to find a good compromise in decisions on what to 
filter and what not? Do you intend to put an extremist conservative Arab 
and and the most liberal German inside the same room, close the door, go 
away, come back after two weeks and look if they could find a compromise 
about Yes or No? How should this work?

The referendum showed that cultural neutrality is important for the 
voters. But how do you think to find a compromise between hell and 
heaven, without having hell and heaven inside the discussions at commons 
at earth?

> * It's likely that staff and Board already know that correlation
> between the results of German Wikipedia referendum and global survey
> could be drawn to support previous two conclusions. Thus, they don't
> want to publish that part of data.
I doubt that. But if they do, I will call them "assholes for betrayal". 
Just to make it clear. It would also not suite the story onto who has 
access to the data and who has not.

> * There is still significant minority of core editors who want the
> filter at any cost.
A "significant minority" is a curios choice of words.

"A significant minority tries to abolish the constitution by any cost". 
Now ask yourself if you would follow their wishes. Thats the same 
sentence, you said, with different actors. Still happy with it?

> * Board is divided and doesn't know what to decide.
We don't know what the board thinks. It does not communicate with us 
(the authors), it did not react to the discussions at Meta, it did not 
answer serious questions and in general is somewhere between a legend 
and a forgotten ghost that no one can see, even if present.

> I would repeat the best possible solution to end this: Implement it on
> English Wikipedia -- you (those who want that filter) have some
> numbers which would support that action -- and leave the rest of the
> projects alone.
That would imply not to implement it on commons. Otherwise the the 
categorization/labeling/... could be misused by local providers inside 
regions that didn't intended to use this feature.

Tobias