[Foundation-l] Copyrighted maps and Derived works from copyrighted sources.

[jamesmikedupont at googlemail.com]

On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 9:35 PM,  <WJhonson at aol.com> wrote:
> "Maps" are not "Points".  You're setting up an argument quite different
> from that with which you started.  They aren't "great maps", they're awful maps
> :)  Explain your bias!  Do you work for Google Maps and are just here
> trolling us?  What's a software key to using a map?
>Are you suggesting that some
> of our maps are extracted from non-public sources?  But again stick to
> points or stick to maps, don't meander all over the board.

My discussion was about both maps and points, it is about the
difference in the policies between the two projects and how we cannot
use the map data from WP because of it.

Ideally I would like to see some type of harmonisation between the two
so that the map data in WP is immediately acceptable and up to the
same standards that OSM has. Why should I not be able to use the maps
and points and other geographic information in WP directly in OSM? I
would love to have the map images georeferenced or even better
available in some type of vector format with exact coordinates.

OK, I will explain exactly my bias and give you a short history:

I have been working on promoting WP and OSM in the Balkans, have been
working alot in Kosovo, and now we are starting in Albania.

We have looked at purchasing sat images for tracing because there are
no good detailed public domain images available. It is expensive, at
least I have cleared up the issue about tracing these images when you
buy them, it seems that all the sat providers give you rights to
trace.

The sat images that google (digital globe) has are the best you will
find of those areas.  You can see the buildings, the streets and all
the relevant features. You cannot see most of those features on the
yahoosat or landsat photos.

We have considered possibilities to legally using these images, but
are running into all types of issues.

I have considered the idea of creating a project that would just trace
the restricted images so that we would extract the vector data for the
streets and then compare them to our current street data for checking.

also that was shot down :
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/h4ck3rm1k3/diary/10108

I have tried to use the wikipedia data points as a starting point for
points on the empty map, but that was rejected by the osm team as I
have pointed out.

Really, I would like to have some clarity on what is doable, what is
legal, what is fair. It seems that WP does not have these issues, and
there are alot of map data that I would even use, but because I dont
know where it comes from, it seems to risky for me.

My arguments here are an attempt to summarise the issues and arguments
that I have heard to get some type of consensus. Ideally, as I said we
would have some constructive dialogue between the two teams and find
some type of agreement.

I am not trying to suggest bad things about WP, I am a big fan of WP!
We have been working on finding new editors, promoting WP in schools
and I have also been working on various little technical projects.

What I am doing is giving you some of the arguments that I have
gotten, and I apologise if I have not done this in the right manner.

I don't want to cause problems or troll at all, and I hope that there
will be some positive outcome from this thread.

I am going to try and wait for more experienced people to comment on
this thread and not cause any more damage than I have already.

thank you for your time and patience,

mike