[Foundation-l] thoughts on leakages

[Florence Devouard]

Jussi-Ville Heiskanen wrote:
> On 1/11/08, Florence Devouard <Anthere9 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Jussi-Ville Heiskanen wrote:
>>> I am sorry, but the minutes of the meeting do not square with what you
>>> say there. According to the minutes - while there may not have been
>>> consensus - there was a clear majority vote in favour of setting a
>>> symmetrical 6 month exlusion period for transitions both board -> staff
>>> and staff -> board.
>> Actually, my memory of the discussion was that Jan-Bart was more in
>> favor of a 12 months waiting period... but the minutes report 6
>> months... which means at least 2 members were not fully happy. And
>> Jimbo's opinion was missing.
>> In any cases, we tend to try to reach consensus when it is seems best
>> to. There was a weak consensus or a slight disagreement.
> 
> Okay, just out of curiosity here, maybe I am dredging out something you
> might not want to revisit, but I recall Angela resigning from the board,
> because she was disillusioned with the way the board was in fact quite
> decidedly steered away from consensus driven decision making.
> 
> Can we now construe this statement by you, Florence Devouard, that
> steering away from consensus driven decision making on the board was
> a mistake?

I have always been a supporter of decisions taken by consensus rather 
than votes. You may remember heated discussions on this matter in the past.
I must also admit that consensus is not always the best choice, when 
decisions drag forever. In a legal organization, we can not always drag 
forever. We have to move on.

This said, I already stated to Angela that I was sorry of what lead her 
to resign.


>>> And (also by the text of the minutes that is published - seems there are
>> some
>>> edits there that are discussing later developements rather than what
>> transpired
>>> at the meeting itself; which is probably illustrative in a positive
>>> fashion, even
>>> though it confuses the text of the minutes as a document of a specific
>> event)
>>> specifically Erik was tasked with drafting the resolution; which after
>> inquiring
>>> with Mike, (someone, not clear who) decided that it was a bylaws matter,
>> not
>>> a resolution matter.
>> I have vague memories. I think Mike recommanded to have it a bylaws
>> update.Yes Note that voting a resolution can be real quick and
>> straightforward. Bylaws update is a little bit more demanding.
> 
> Well, this is very not clear, as you can well imagine. Maybe in addition
> of minutes, you should make private notes, so your memories are not
> so vague. The order of events here is very important, and quite decidedly
> obfuscated in the preceding paragraph.

In october 2007, I was the chair of this organization. Not its 
secretary. It is not very easy to chair a two days meetings, be involved 
in the discussion as well AND take notes. I beg your pardon, but I think 
this is exactly why there are two positions, secretary and chair.


> Was Erik tasked with drafting a resolution, or was Erik tasked with asking
> Mike how and/or if such a resolution could be drafted, and or what happened
> after that... really, I can ascribe many possible chains of events that square
> well with people doing their best to clarify the situation, but vague statements
> don't improve my ability to believe any one of them actually took place.

The best to do will be to ask the secretary.

>>> I think you got EC:s suggestion backwards. His idea was that the board
>>> would propose and decide, but the council would approve. It isn't implicit
>>> what would happen if the council would vote down a decided change in
>>> the bylaws. As I see it, the disapproval would not mean the change could
>>> not be implemented by the board, but it might usefully force the board
>>> to reconsider, and re-vote on it. This is a very usual parliamentary
>> custom.
>>
>> ok
>> I think it would put a very huge pressure on the wikicouncil constitution...
> 
> Well, I think the question is do you really want a wikicouncil, or a
> wikipoodle?

What is a wikipoodle ?


> --
> Jussi-Ville Heiskanen, ~ [[User:Cimon Avaro]]
> 
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