[Foundation-l] Wikimania 2008 will happen, in Alexandria, Egypt

[Ray Saintonge]

Jason Safoutin wrote:
> Here is why I am entirely opposed to Wikimania being in Egypt.
>
> 1) Since the announcement of this, the LGBT wikimedians have expressed 
> grave concern. As mentioned previously, this is a regime in which 
> "opresses" homosexuals and imprisons them. Me being gay, I am not sure I 
> would want to risk that. Not to mention my partner, if I had one and he 
> came, but yet the WMF states that they picked Egypt because of its 
> "geo-diversity 
> <http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimania-l/2007-October/000719.html>."
>   
George has already effectively destroyed this argument.
> 2) Human rights and "free" speech (free being the key word). Why hold a 
> conference of a foundation that is based entirely on FREE media when 
> that country and the government don't even support free speech? Why in 
> an country that limits the rights of women and humans in general? What 
> is so "free" about that?
>   
Their lack of free speech is not a sufficient justification for 
self-righteousness.  Freedom must have an indigenous origin, and be 
suited to the prevailing circumstances in that country.  The one thing 
that we can do there is model the benefits of free speech; our example 
can do more more for them than a lot of whining and complaining about 
how unfree they are.
> 3) Egypt is in too close proximity to several areas which are in a near 
> constant war: Israel and Palestine, Sudan, Iran, Iraq, Pakistan and 
> Afghanistan...not to mention holding this is the Middle East puts (for 
> the most part) Americans at risk and the rest at risk for a prime target 
> of violence or an attack. Was safety considered when making this decision?
>   
This strikes me as paranoid.  Egypt is not a party to these conflicts.  
If its neighbours choose to have wars between themselves that has no 
relevance.  I don't see the point in singling out Americans as more at 
risk than the citizens of other countries if not to reflect the bad 
behaviour of their government in the area.  Americans do keep visiting 
the pyramids, and that brings much needed revenue into the country.  I'm 
sure that the Egyptian government is well aware of the importance of 
ensuring the safety of foreign visitors from all countries.
> 4) Who are these people on the "jury"? I mean I know their names, but 
> who are they. Are they wealthy? Travel the world frequently? Seems like 
> it because in my opinion this place was picked because it was somewhere 
> they decided it would be nice to visit. More than half of all 
> wikimedians will likely NOT be able to afford the trip, in some cases 
> from literally on the other side of the globe. Might as well rob a bank 
> for the finances.
>   
The jury members are more than familiar with what it is to attend 
Wikimania.  Groups in various cities need to put together a bid.  no-one 
wants to bring Wikimania to a city that does not want it.  I welcome the 
efforts made to develop objective standards for choosing from these cities.

Having Wikimania close to you will make your travel easier and cheaper, 
but there will still be an other side of the world.  The expenses will 
still need to be borne by someone else.
> 5) The "jury" was composed of, from what I see, 12 individuals who in 
> some way or another "work" for WMF (and that does NOT necessarily mean 
> getting paid). I see IMO a conflict of interest. The other 2 seem to be 
> just contributers, which is what most of this jury should have been 
> composed of. After all this is a conference for all Wikis.
>   
Most of them are contributors, but not just to the English Wikipedia.  
They need to have some experience to be able to evaluate the bids in all 
the practical considerations that go into making a good conference.  
There is more to this than the politics of the host country.
> I am NOT against ever having a Wikimania in the Middle East or 
> eventually in Egypt. But right now, it's not the right time. We need to 
> think about how diverse our contributers are and base a decision off 
> that. In my opinion there are a lot better, safer and more 
> "geo-diversed" places than somewhere where there is a potential for 
> people to be injured or killed or go broke just getting there.
Geo-diversity cannot be based on a single conference.  It is based on an 
extended series of conferences that go to a new place each year.  Arabic 
is a very widely spoken language.  It is third or fourth in terms of the 
number of countries in which it is regularly and officially spoken.

Ec