[Foundation-l] university blocking wikipedia

[Florence Devouard]

Thomas Dalton wrote:
>> Recently, I read a report from a French teacher. He enjoys a certain
>> reputation in the teaching environment, so whilst not all agree with
>> him, he is certainly listened to by many.
>>
>> He made a comment which I thought was interesting.
>>
>> He said "Wikipedia can not be used in the French formal educational
>> system (schools) because our nation is laic, whilst Wikipedia follows
>> the neutral point of view. Being laic means that our schools precisely
>> chose a certain value framework and deliberately educate the kids to
>> hold certain beliefs and share certain values. On the contrary,
>> wikipedia holds that all points of view must be given room. For this
>> reason, Wikipedia is not compatible with our schooling system and should
>> not be used as a resource".
>>
>> I found that approach interesting indeed. For once, the issue he was
>> raising was not so much a question of quality or of stability of the
>> information, or even of manipulation, but simply a statement "we want
>> our kids to learn that certain things are true, and others are not true.
>> Or certain things are good, and others are not good. Wikipedia is a
>> great resource, but can't be used as teaching support".
>>
>> Topics that come to my mind are of course topics such as revisionism,
>> cults, creationism, or pedophilia.
> 
> Interesting viewpoint. Wikipedia is incompatible with the French
> education system, due to a different definition of "truth". I would
> say it's a failing in the French (and many other nation's) education
> system, more than anything else, but then if I didn't firmly believe
> in NPOV, I wouldn't be emailing foundation-l, would I?

I fear I would consider this approach a little bit too simplistic 
Thomas. The goals of education are usually considered to be 4. 
Intellectual goal, economic purpose, but also social and political/civic 
purpose. Education is a political process, with some political outcomes.
For example, schools are in particular the place where new immigrants 
really get integrated, the place where they learn the values of one 
nation, and learn a common history, and learn to create a common 
background to be able to live with others in harmony.
On that note, the USA schools are actually much more efficient than the 
french ones to create a deep feeling of being american. When I lived 
there, I was always impressed at how quickly an immigrant was engulfed 
in the american way of life. This is not something that my country 
succeeds in very well.
Part of the reasons this integration is so efficient is that the schools 
somehow follow a certain curricula, teach certain values, choose to 
teach or not certain point of views.
One of the things that astonished me when I lived in the USA was to 
realise how many americans actually believed in creationism. In France, 
even the most fanatic of our catholics believe in evolutionism. 
Creationism is not even mentionned at school. I heard that in the USA, 
in some schools, it was the opposite. I guess both schools (the french 
and the americans ones) would fear using a wikipedia article on the topic.

Well, I firmly believe in NPOV, but as a mom, I also consider that I 
should have the freedom to decide 1) what my kids are taught and 2) when 
they are offered certain information I consider restricted. I do think 
that schools should educate the kids in the value system commonly 
followed in a country. I would not ban Wikipedia (it is stupid, the kids 
gets to it at home), rather educate teachers to use it well, but I can 
not blame someone who considers that Wikipedia can not be confused with 
a textbook, adapted to the value system of the nation. I consider that 
his view point, not a failure of him. I do not think I am in a position 
of considering my position is the truth and his the error :-)

ant