[Foundation-l] Fair Use (again)

geni geniice at gmail.com
Mon Jan 29 21:13:13 UTC 2007

On 1/29/07, George Herbert <george.herbert at gmail.com> wrote:
> We're not an 800 pound gorilla; but we're much more than a dancing macacque.

We're neither. For most the net we are wallpaper.

> I would like to second Cunctator's comments in general.  Specifically,
> while I encourage the development of free content wherever possible, I
> want to be realistic that there's a tradeoff between covering
> something well and covering something badly but with entirely free
> content.  I will always come down on the side of  a better
> encyclopedia if an appropriate, legal fair use content add will better
> Wikipedia noticably.

> I had someone just last week suggest that we could find free
> replacement images for a spacecraft which had been assembled and flown
> in space already, both for the spacecraft under construction and for
> the landing.  The only people who took and released photos of the
> assembly who are known are the official space agency photographers
> (not NASA, India's ISRO), and the landing took place several hundred
> kilometers out to sea, with one Indian Coast Guard ship and some
> helicopters in attendance.  How exactly are we supposed to go back in
> time and convince a free-license photographer to go take pictures of
> those events that already happened?  How do we convince ISRO and the
> Indian Coast Guard to let them do it?

Experience suggests it or scale models will turn up in a museum

For example:


> If we don't fight for the meaning and use of Fair Use, we both lose
> content for ourselves, and lose content for the whole community at
> large by not helping to uphold fair use vigorously.

I know of two legal systems that have fair use. People living under
other systems get by.

> If Wikipedia won't stand up for Fair Use, then it's a pretty sad
> world.

It is get used to it.

>We can be strident in supporting fair use, legal and proper in
> supporting fair use, and still prefer and work to create free content.
>  They are not mutually exclusive.

Then why was I deleting trivially replaceable non free images for
rather a lot of last week? Are you seriously going to tell that since
February 2006 no one has been in a position to make a pic of Pickled

> But those who say "oh, if we remove
> it, free content of equal value will just sprint forth to replace it"
> frustrate me to no end.  It won't, in a lot of cases, because it
> can't.

Experience suggests otherwise and at present time there is no
significant movement toward deleting all fair use material.

> Promotional photos of all types are generally accepted to be put out
> there by people and companies to be reused.

Please provide details of the licence they are under


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