[Foundation-l] in defence of Google

Till Weber peterpanini at gmx.net
Sun Jan 21 09:40:56 UTC 2007

Anthony, I don´t think it is posible to merge both projects, wikiasari and peerpedia. Though the central person is Jim Wales, but he already decided to built a project without the foundation and one for profit. As well the proposal concept for wikiasari is still missing, if it is central or decentral. So I recommend to have the wikifoundation to run as well a search propject the p2p way.

Just my to cents. If there are persons, which decide to act, it then really a question of freedom in organizations. Open source is one thing, but freedom from the hierachy is one other.


-------- Original-Nachricht --------
An: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List <foundation-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
Betreff: Re: [Foundation-l] in defence of Google

> -------- Original-Nachricht --------
> > I'd love to see Google torn down and replaced with an open source
> > collaborative search engine run democratically by the world.  I'd love
> > to have access to a search engine as good as Google, with a truly open
> > API (i.e. sans http://code.google.com/apis/soapsearch/api_terms.html),
> > and with all the results being released under an open content license.
> >  Is Wikimedia the one to do that?  It's arguable whether it'd be
> > within the scope of the Foundation's mission.  And in any case, I
> > haven't seen a reasonable proposal of how to do it.  So I guess when
> > it comes to that point, we're both in agreement.  And yeah.  Google
> > did good.  Google does good.  But Google did bad, too.  Google does
> > bad, too.  And Microsoft also did/does good/bad.
> > 
> > Anthony
> > 
> Who is in defence of Google? Wikifoundation?
> "wikifoundation in defence of Google"
> The problem is, Jimmy is one of the founders of wikipedia, has nothing to
> do with wikiseek; and wikiasari is a concept supported by a lot of people.
> But: If wikifoundation makes a peerpedia-search, this means that there are
> several conflicts. Is wikiasari more in solidarity to wikiseek, because
> they both are for-profit ads-projects? or more in solidarity to peerpedia, to
> support the core competencies of the foundation? 
> Wikifoundation need the courage, to steal Jimmies Idea to make it (a
> search project) really open with p2p and without ads.
> Ok, this is not about one person and I do not want to annoy anyone, so
> let´s talk about the peerpedia project of the foundation here on this list.
> Wikiasari is a different project on a different list.
> This simple sentence, said by Jim originally, means foe the rest of the
> foundation members, to have the courage, to first develop a similar project
> and split the development. This must be the rest of the foundation board
> members aware of. Acting like wikiseek and play a card against the
> wikisariproject. And this card here was suggested as a peerpedia-search, which means
> (as the url was announced with a concept) to set up several yacy.net servers
> to index the web p2p.
> (Or: Jim has to be asked, if he is agreeing to make wikiasari a kind of a
> peerpedia project and if we are pulling the same goals. He still has not
> announced, if nutch or yacy is on the three servers and/or if there is a
> cooperation with the foundation, last I guess not, but if this is clear, this
> means we need couraged people to do the same from the foundation side but
> only p2p with the community). 
> I wonder, why the members here on the list doubt the core cometencies or
> Mission of the foundation, if the peerpedia-search project is in accordance.
> Here is the mission again:
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Mission_statement
> you see, several stars fit the project and social software is nutch not at
> all, it is yacy, this is why I recomment to ask Jim to join the peerpedia
> idea with his large knowledge and history experience.
> We could wook out a proposal (which jim announced the day before his
> disney journey on anotehr list,  but still has not published) together, here is
> the peerpedia "blanket" for this:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_P2-search_peerpedia
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Mission_statement
> The general purpose and objectives of the Foundation shall be the
> following:
> Wikimedia Foundation is dedicated to the development and maintenance of
> online *free*, *open content* encyclopedias, collections of quotations,
> textbooks *and other collections of documents*, *information*, and other
> informational *databases* in *all* the languages of the world that will be
> distributed free of charge to the public under a free documentation license such
> as the Free Documentation License written by the Free Software Foundation
> Inc. at http://www.fsf.org or similar licensing scheme, see
> http://www.wikimedia.org.
> The goals of the foundation are to *encourage* the further growth and
> development of *open content*, *****social software**** WikiWiki-based projects
> (see http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki) and to provide the full contents
> of those projects to the public free of charge. In addition to managing the
> already developed multilingual general encyclopedia and almanac named
> Wikipedia, (http://www.wikipedia.org) there is a multi-language dictionary and
> thesaurus named Wiktionary, an encyclopedia of quotations named Wikiquote,
> a collection of e-book resources aimed specifically toward students (such
> as textbooks and annotated public domain books) named Wikibooks and a
> collection of source works called Wikisource; other projects are envisioned like
> **peerpedia** - the open source search-engine yacy.net community in a p2p
> style. The Foundation also manages the operations of the largely dormant
> Nupedia project (which is not a wiki but is open content).
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2007-January/date.html
> BTW: we discuss here only in a free brainstorming, and indeed the leader
> of foundation and the leader of wikia should meet at a round tabel and
> discuss, if a collaboration is possible, and if the foundation is behind the p2p
> idea, which several times was stated as the only way to have 1 Mio google
> servers in defence. If both leaders or the board does not agree, the
> question is open, if the foundation is willing to start and found a
> yacy-wikipedia-indexing serverfarm project with several servers.
> Ok, let´s say each year we add 2 servers. Is this too much?
> Yacysearch.com has done this in one weel with 7 servers.
> Kind regards.

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