[Foundation-l] Vandalism and small wikis

[Darko Bulatovic]

Gerard Meijssen wrote:
> Darko Bulatovic schreef:
>   
>> Yann Forget wrote:
>>   
>>     
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Some wikis are plagued with vandalism, spams and non sense. Moldavan
>>> Wikipedia seems the worst at this time, but there have been others too.
>>> These projects do not bring any free knowledge to anybody, just a lot of
>>> works for volunteers (hopefully there are great volunteers like Pill)
>>> and stewards.
>>>
>>> Regarding the Moldavan Wikipedia (http://mo.wikipedia.org), the
>>> administrators election was already cancelled twice because of massive
>>> attacks. Sincere editors have been discouraged and have left. So the
>>> wiki is just a battle field for vandals, trolls and sockpuppets. There
>>> is no expected improvement in the near future because the language
>>> itself is in the middle of a political controversy.
>>>
>>> I forsee the same situation for the Montenegrin Wikipedia if it is
>>> created. These wikis only give a bad image of Wikimedia. I think that
>>> the Foundation should take its responsibilities and take some decisions.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Yann
>>>   
>>>     
>>>       
>> I cant believe my eyes that you Yann say this. How in the God sake you 
>> can forsee such thing about Montenegrin wikipedia? Montenegrin wikipedia 
>> gives bad image of Wikimedia? This statement that you did give bad image 
>> to WMF.  You don't have any  argument to say this and to support your 
>> statement.
>> Please elaborate this on Montenegrin request for Wikipedia.
>>
>> Wikipedia is multilingual and multicultural project, without that WMF 
>> don't have right to use that statement. What was done with Montenegrin 
>> request is just showing what kind of lobbying is possible on WMF.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Darko bulatovic
>> President of IT Association of Montenegro
>>     
> Hoi,
> Wikipedia is in its manifestations very much a multilingual project and 
> very much not a multicultural project. Cultural and political reasons 
> are not a reason to start another project. When you read the article 
> about Montenegrin, the language on the English Wikipedia, it explains 
> quite clearly that elements that are to make Montegrin special can be 
> found outside of Montenegro as well. This means that from a linguistic 
> point of view the case for a Montenegrin Wikipedia is pretty weak.
>
> There are languages where the cultural and political differences are 
> quite big while there is no call for a split project. The Chinese and 
> the Dutch wikipedias are good examples for this. It would be a good 
> thing if you could find it in you to consider this and retract the 
> application for a Montenegrin Wikipedia.
>
> Thanks,
>     GerardM
>
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>   
Gerard,

I don't understand why you mis interpret my statement. Please notice 
"and". Who advice you on this meter? Political background of languages 
is undiscussable . There must be political background of language, as 
there must be political will to make standard from people language. 
Linguistics rules are just political will on people language. If you 
ignore this your opinion will not be righteous. I will repeat my sentence:
- Wikipedia is multilingual and multicultural project.

As I sad, culture is connected with language, and culture is spread by 
communication, beside other ways of communication language is primary one.

 >.When you read the article
 >about Montenegrin, the language on the English Wikipedia, it explains
 >quite clearly that elements that are to make Montegrin special can be
 >found outside of Montenegro as well.

Do you know what you talk about? Do you know who write those articles? 
Do you know anything about specifics of Montenegrin dialect of south 
slavenian languages?

Split of project is not our concern (As Montenegrin people are never 
participated on this projects or they tried on marginal level), you know 
well  why is was divided on Balkan, but you stay quiet on this. Special 
regarding Serbian. Wikipedia is used for spreading of nationalism and 
now when Montenegrin wish to have their own wikipedia on their own 
language, it become problem. AND yes it become POLITICAL problem for WMF 
or one part of their members. I am aware that Serbian community is very 
strong on WMF. But to this aspect of discussion is not place here. My 
question is what argument do you have on this? Did you check them or you 
just used POV to discuss on this topic?


Please, English is not my native language, and I don't see how you could 
miss interpret my statement about multilingual and multi cultural nature 
of wikipedia. Every language bring up cultural aspect and I don't see 
how you could by-pass this.

And again please return to the topic explain to me how you can be that 
CLAIRVOYANCE and  assume that Montenegrin wikipedia will bring such bad 
image to WMF . You don't have arguments for that. This is just showing 
to me that you take POV. You just assume this with (for me) no 
particular reason. So I can just guess here why you are doing this. 
Please be more specific about your goals here, so I don't assume that 
you just take POV here.

I am ready to participate on any level of discussion but please don't 
make assumptions as that will bring bad connotation to your willingness 
to do right thing in this case.


Thank you,
Darko Bulatovic
President of  IT Association of Montenegro