[Foundation-l] English Wikipedia ethnocentric policy affects other communities

Birgitte SB birgitte_sb at yahoo.com
Sat Dec 23 00:31:31 UTC 2006

--- George Herbert <george.herbert at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 12/22/06, Gerard Meijssen
> <gerard.meijssen at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Gregory Maxwell schreef:
> > > On 12/22/06, Birgitte SB <birgitte_sb at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> The en.WP Username policy has been changed.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > > Unfortunatly, it was changed without any valid
> basis.
> > >
> > > It is not acceptable to remove longstanding
> policy simply because some
> > > people on a mailing list decided to speculate
> randomly and accuse
> > > enwiki of "ethnocentricism" without
> substantiation.
> > >
> > > As a result I've reverted the change and
> contributed some suggestions
> > > to the talk page.
> > >
> > > I agree that the policy should be *improved* to
> address the real
> > > concerns brought up, and to be more friendly to
> users who work across
> > > many languages.  Simply removing the section
> does not, however,
> > > address the very real issues which caused the
> creation of the policy
> > > in the first place.
> > Hoi,
> > Some people congratulated me with the outcome of
> this affair. My
> > reaction was that it did not feel like a victory
> because I feel bruised
> > by the experience. Having said this, your
> suggestion that there has been
> > no substantiation about the grievance that was put
> forward is seriously
> > wrong.
> There is no substantiation that the en.WP policy is
> due to ethnocentrism.
> Please don't generalize from "We find that your
> claim of ethnocentrism
> is unfounded" to "We find that your entire claim
> that this policy is
> bad is unfounded".
> > The notion that it is up to you to revert this
> change continues
> > to make this affair even more painful. Simply
> reverting this change and
> > thereby denying that many of the reasons why this
> policy was put in
> > place is seriously wrong.
> The only person entitled to make a unilateral policy
> change is Jimbo.
> The policy IS policy - it's been there, agreed to,
> been standard, been
> used to do a lot of vandal-fighting.  The policy has
> become
> controversial due to the SUL and cross-wiki and
> charges that it's
> insensitive to other language speakers.  But it is
> not resolved and
> consensus agreed to that it's wrong and needs to get
> changed right
> now.
> Consensus doesn't mean "We brought up this issue, it
> started an
> argument, we changed it while people still disagree
> and there's no
> clear majority."  It means "Talk about it until
> people actually agree
> on something, and THEN change it.".
> > I have to say I am increasingly upset by this
> affair.
> As am I.  What is wrong with talking it out before
> any changes are
> made, rather than insisting on acting unilaterally
> without regard to
> others' concerns?
> The insistence that this has to be done, by fiat,
> grossly offensive.  There is no emergency rush here.
>  There is nothing
> at all wrong with talking about it and figuring out
> what the
> least-painful overall solution is before anything
> gets changed.
> -- 
> -george william herbert
> george.herbert at gmail.com

Where are you picking up that this is being done
anyone is insisting on being done right now from this
list.  I think everyone on this list would be content
is en.WP said "We don't know exactly how we will fix
this but by the time SUL goes live we pledge that
accounts established from other wikis will no longer
be forced to change names." 

I also cannot how you can think this is being done by
fiat.  The policy was changed by an en.WP admin who I
have *never* seen active outside of en.WP.  I do not
see him participating on this list or discussing the
issue with people outside of en.WP.  I could be wrong
if he uses another name here but I am not aware of him
having anything to do with people here outside of
en.WP.  Also the issue has been raised on the talk
page as far back as October, I do not see how you can
claim there is a lack of disscussion.  If you believe
the change was done inappropriately without consensus,
take that up with Radiant.  But do not accuse us here
of making this change by fiat without talking about
it!  That is out of line.

Birgitte SB

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