[Foundation-l] Re: Chapters, deductibility and donation profiles (was Wikimania 2006 - host city contest to open onSeptember 1st 20)

[Anthere]

Arne Klempert wrote:

Thanks for answering Arne

> On 8/17/05, Anthere <anthere9 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
>>A week ago, at Wikimania, when it was pointed out that the german
>>chapter had money, while the french and the italian did not, I suggested
>>that possibly some of the german money could be used for other chapters,
>>in particular when there is common currency and these countries are in
>>certain common frame (here, european union). I am not sure I got a
>>positive feedback on this (nor a negative actually).
> 
> 
> The problem with this, like with almost every idea on how to spend the
> german money is that we don't really know yet if it's possible :(
> 
> 
>>Maybe it would help to clarify in which cases we could actually use the
>>money and in which we can not.
> 
> 
> This question is not easy to answer. The usual case for a charity
> organisation in Germany is to spend money for its own undertakings.
>>From what I know (I'm neither an expert in this field, nor am I the
> treasurer) every other spending is more or less difficult. Spending
> money in Germany (for hardware or almost everything else) would be the
> easiest way. Likewise easy would it be to buy hardware in Germany and
> ship it to a data center, let's say in Amsterdam, providing the
> purpose of this hardware is easy to explain (to the tax office) in the
> sense that it can be separated from other things (eg. we wanted to buy
> a big tool server until a nice company came around and donated us
> one). Unfortunately, adding to the existing server park is much more
> complicated to explain to the tax office.
> 
> To pay for general hardware might be possible but would probably be
> much more difficult. For example, it *might* be possible to buy
> general hardware in Germany, send it to Amsterdam and explain how it
> is used to the tax office. This gets much more complicated if we buy
> hardware in the US and add it to an existing pool. The idea is that
> starting a whole new data center, anywhere in the world, as our own
> undertaking, run by German money, would be easier to endorse as a
> "Wikimedia Deutschland undertaking".
> 
> If Wikimedia Deutschland´s money is to be only a part of an existing
> pool, then we need a clear idea of what Wikimedia wants to do (not
> only now, but also in the next year or the year after). Then, and only
> then, once we have a plan, a budget... we can ask a tax professional
> to tell us, how this is possible and how - which paperwork (project
> descriptions, contracts) is needed. To be sure that the tax office
> will accept this later, we need to ask them beforehand. This will take
> time, perhaps a few months (until they might respond with more
> questions ...)
> 
> So far we (or at least I) have no idea what the mid-term plans are.
> Some months ago the Kennisnet cluster seemed to be a comparative easy
> option. But as I understood Jimbo, this is not an option "now". As I
> said above this "now" is part of our problem. Given the work and time
> it needs to find *one* way to spend a lot of our money and given the
> fact that Wikimedia Deutschland not only now has money but will
> probably have much more in the next months and years it would be much
> more effective to work on mid-term plans. I wonder if this is
> possible.

All right. In short, we should try to do some yearly budgeting for next 
year. I also wonder if this is possible, but possibly, with a full year 
past experience, this might be possible.


>>* paying some travel costs which would otherwise be paid by the
>>Foundation (easy enough probably would be to pay for some speakers to
>>come to wikimania in Germany, but would it be possible for a german
>>chapter to pay travel for Jimbo to Germany to meet with german partners,
>>or for the german chapter to pay travel for Angela to go to South Africa
>>to meet with some possible african partners ?)
> 
> 
> Yes, we can pay for travel costs (in principle). But I'm not sure what
> the tax office would say if we  spent 10k Euro for travel expenses,
> for people who are not flying from or to Germany or are not somehow
> connected with Wikimedia Deutschland.


Okay. This is why I suggested Angela. She is not a member of the german 
association, but definitely flying from Germany.


> BTW: As far as I know Wikimedia Deutschland did agree on paying 50% of
> Tim's ticket for his trip to Berlin in December 2004. We never
> reimbursed the money to the Foundation because we never got a bill :(

Ouch. Right.

>>* Paying for some promotional items (easy enough in german for a
>>conference in Germany, but would it be possible to pay the publishing of
>>an italian-language leaflet for a conference in Belgium for example ?)
> 
> 
> Yes, we can pay for promotional items (in principle). Unless we don't
> spend huge amounts on this, nobody will ask us, in which language the
> stuff is printed and where and to whom it was given.

We should use this opportunity at next big meetup up in Europe (Fosdem 
type ?)

>>* Paying people for certain activities (such as, but non restricted to,
>>development). Could these people be paid if non german ? Could they be
>>paid to work on global issues ? (for example, grant specialist ?)
> 
> 
> Yes, paying people to improve free software is totally ok, but again,
> this has to be well documented (what project is the developer working
> on?). A grants specialist working abroad would be harder to explain,
> but one in Germany working on grants in which Wikimedia Deutschland is
> involved should be no problem.

For now, I can not think of a wise idea about this, but this is good to 
keep in mind.

> In all these discussions we also have to keep in mind that the German
> board is responsible for the money, and this not only in a legal way.
> This also has moral implications. To give an example: Even if it is
> legally okay, I would find it very hard to explain to the German
> donators that *all* of their money has been spent on plane tickets or
> a single development task or something like that.

Agreed

> I would be very happy if we can work together on other mid- or
> long-term ideas to spend our money. And while we are doing this we
> should give some money for some of the things mentioned above.
> 
> -- Arne (akl)

I suppose it would be easier as well to spend it on european-projects or 
  areas. We probably need to make a second type of budget as well, 
involving the chapters. Could not a global budget, with certain expenses 
being dedicated to local chapters help getting understanding from the 
tax office ?

ermmm, and what about spending some of the money to get an expert in 
international organisations help to figure out how to organise all this ?