[Commons-l] 100 years old images

[Robert Rohde]

On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 12:26 PM, Daniel Kinzler <daniel at brightbyte.de>
wrote:

> > Sorry, but you are wrong on several points:
> > 1. The French law is 70 years pma.
> > 2. Alain-Fournier is born in 1882, and was 18 years old in 1904.
> > 3. The picture was made in 1904, on Alain-Fournier's 18 birthday.
>
> So... how old was the *photographer* when the image was taken? Let's use
> the
> exmaple from the deletion request. If the photographer was 40 in 1904 and
> lived
> to be 74 (not unreasonable), so he died in 1938, the Photo would only
> become PD
> next year (70 years *pma*). If he was only 30 when he took the image and
> died in
> 1948, it's in copyright for another 10 years. This is not taking into
> account
> the extensions of copyright given for the time of the world wars by  french
> law
> -- a total of nearly 15 extra years of copyright. If the creator was killed
> in
> either war, there's even an extension of 30 years.
>
> So, assuming PD for an image that is 100 years old means assuming the
> photographer lived no more than 30 years after taking the picture -- not a
> safe
> bet. For France, the situation is even worse, because of the extensions
> mentioned above.
>
> I think some rule of thumb was established at some point, but I'm not sure
> what
> is was. I think 200 years would be safe, and perhaps 150 are also. but even
> 120
> are not enough, IMHO.
>
> Anyway... you said we accept content that is a lot less safe than this.
> Like
> what, exactly?



The US allows the assumption that copyright has expired 120 years after a
work was created in cases where the author's date of death has never been
recorded with the copyright office.  In other words, the US default position
is that authors live 50 years after creating their work in the absense of
evidence to the contrary.

France may have a similar escape clause, but I don't know.

-Robert rohde
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