Thank you, Eric and André. This is a very useful
synthesis of our
conversation. I have added comments, and I see Andrew has also added
comments.
What do you think the next steps should be?
Best,
João
Em seg., 27 de fev. de 2023 às 15:04, Eric Luth <eric.luth(a)wikimedia.se>
escreveu:
Hi all,
Thanks for a great call last week!
André and I have tried to gather the input during the meeting and from
the chat into one structured document, that we would like to add to a Meta
page. It would be great to know if you think we capture the conversation
well:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_tKPkUzAlaCpOuyStygkKwTQDjlSkAjnYHkp7Pr…
Also, we were considering linking to the Etherpad document from the Meta
page, to save the clever insights from the conversation. But as it includes
names – please tell us if you don't want us to add a link to the Etherpad
document.
Best
*Eric Luth*
Projektledare engagemang och påverkan | Project Manager, Involvement and
Advocacy
Wikimedia Sverige
eric.luth(a)wikimedia.se
+46 (0) 765 55 50 95
Stöd fri kunskap, bli medlem i Wikimedia Sverige.
Läs mer på blimedlem.wikimedia.se
Den fre 24 feb. 2023 kl 12:07 skrev Fiona Romeo <fromeo(a)wikimedia.org>rg>:
> Thanks Eric for convening this week's meeting about the content
> partnerships hub and Andrew for the draft manifesto.
>
> For the more specific discussion about GLAM metrics needs, the product
> team has created this page for you to document your requirements:
>
>
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Product_and_technical_support_fo…
>
> I appreciate that you have already shared your needs in many different
> channels, at different times, but this page will have the right audience at
> the right time.
>
> Thanks for your patience and collaboration.
>
> Fiona
>
> On Tue, 21 Feb 2023 at 16:06, Andrew Lih <andrew.lih(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Thank you Eric, Axel, Sandra F., and Wikimedia Sweden for leading in
>> this area, even though we recognize it does fall out of the scope of the
>> formal Content Partnerships Hub project.
>>
>> A few thoughts ahead of the meeting:
>>
>> 1. As mentioned previously, I have tried to put down some aggregated
>> thoughts and experiences in this document on meta which anyone is welcome
>> to edit/add/share:
>>
>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedians_in_Residence_Exchange_Network/G…
>>
>> 2. If nothing else, I encourage folks to add ideas (raw ideas are
>> definitely fine) to the section "New approaches"
>>
>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedians_in_Residence_Exchange_Network/G…
>>
>> 3. Please consider "manifesto" as sounding more scary or threatening
>> than it should be - it was simply the word we had been talking about for a
>> while, as the goal was: How do we explain the current GLAM wiki state of
>> affairs to someone new to this space, whether it is a new WMF employee, an
>> outsider who doesn't know about cultural or heritage partnerships?
>>
>> Thanks all,
>> -Andrew
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 9:54 AM Eric Luth <eric.luth(a)wikimedia.se>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> The meeting will take place at 16:00 UTC tomorrow on this link:
>>>
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81455808411
>>>
<https://www.google.com/url?q=https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81455808411&sa=D&source=calendar&ust=1677422345273437&usg=AOvVaw2PGvR3NmIQDqmPoiv_h3mv>
>>> André and I will join on behalf of Wikimedia Sverige and the Content
>>> Partnerships Hub initiative. Feel free to share the link with anyone you
>>> think might be good to bring to the call.
>>>
>>> André and I will get back to you with an agenda as soon as possible,
>>> but the main part is of course to listen in and understand the situation,
>>> and discuss the priorities, as per Axel's previous email.
>>>
>>> Best
>>> *Eric Luth*
>>> Projektledare engagemang och påverkan | Project Manager, Involvement
>>> and Advocacy
>>> Wikimedia Sverige
>>> eric.luth(a)wikimedia.se
>>> +46 (0) 765 55 50 95
>>>
>>> Stöd fri kunskap, bli medlem i Wikimedia Sverige.
>>> Läs mer på blimedlem.wikimedia.se
>>>
>>>
>>> Den mån 20 feb. 2023 kl 17:23 skrev Axel Pettersson <
>>> axel.pettersson(a)wikimedia.se>gt;:
>>>
>>>> Hi again,
>>>> Thanks for all the replies to the Doodle, the winner is Wednesday
>>>> February 22, 17.00-18.00 (GMT+1).
>>>>
>>>> @Eric Luth <eric.luth(a)wikimedia.se> will send out a calendar
invite
>>>> with a meeting link and agenda tomorrow.
>>>>
>>>> Bästa hälsningar,
>>>> /axel
>>>>
>>>> ====================================
>>>> Axel Pettersson (han/honom)
>>>> Projektledare GLAM/Outreach
>>>> Wikimedia Sverige
>>>>
>>>> +46 (0)733 96 55 65
>>>> axel.pettersson(a)wikimedia.se
>>>>
>>>> Twitter: @Haxpett <https://twitter.com/haxpett>
>>>>
>>>> Stöd fri kunskap, bli medlem i Wikimedia Sverige.
>>>> Läs mer på *wikimedia.se/sv/blimedlem
>>>> <http://wikimedia.se/sv/blimedlem>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Den tors 16 feb. 2023 kl 13:48 skrev Axel Pettersson <
>>>> axel.pettersson(a)wikimedia.se>gt;:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> (Sent on behalf of the helpdesk.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Andrew also sent a request to the Content Partnerships Hub helpdesk
>>>>> about this issue. We very much hear everyone’s concerns. Though the
>>>>> Helpdesk typically deals with content uploads, we do have another
part of
>>>>> the hub initiative that is preparing for better (strategic) tools
support
>>>>> in the upcoming year(s).[1]
>>>>>
>>>>> Our current capacity is however very limited, and we are still not
>>>>> sure what funding we will receive for our future work. Also, we
currently
>>>>> lack manpower and skills for this type of immediate fire-fighting, so
if we
>>>>> were to work on this, it would be at the expense of other
prioritized
>>>>> software development.
>>>>>
>>>>> As a response to the Helpdesk request, we would therefore suggest
>>>>> setting up a meeting with all interested people on this thread, with
the
>>>>> goal to share perspectives and to brainstorm an approach and capture
your
>>>>> thoughts on priorities.
>>>>>
>>>>> Please provide your availability in this Doodle:
>>>>>
https://doodle.com/meeting/participate/id/dLZwmRWa (With excuses
>>>>> for being Europe/America friendly over other time zones.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Please note that Sandra Fauconnier (who works as Product
>>>>> Strategist) will be absent from February 15 for at least a month (due
to
>>>>> surgery + recovery period). During her absence, André Costa (
>>>>> andre.costa(a)wikimedia.se) from WMSE will represent the Content
>>>>> Partnerships Hub on this topic.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> [1]
>>>>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Content_Partnerships_Hub/Software
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bästa hälsningar,
>>>>> /axel
>>>>>
>>>>> ====================================
>>>>> Axel Pettersson (han/honom)
>>>>> Projektledare GLAM/Outreach
>>>>> Wikimedia Sverige
>>>>>
>>>>> +46 (0)733 96 55 65
>>>>> axel.pettersson(a)wikimedia.se
>>>>>
>>>>> Twitter: @Haxpett <https://twitter.com/haxpett>
>>>>>
>>>>> Stöd fri kunskap, bli medlem i Wikimedia Sverige.
>>>>> Läs mer på *wikimedia.se/sv/blimedlem
>>>>> <http://wikimedia.se/sv/blimedlem>*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Den tis 14 feb. 2023 kl 06:38 skrev Andrew Lih <
>>>>> andrew.lih(a)gmail.com>gt;:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Today, Wikimedia Cloud had an outage that highlights the fragile
>>>>>> nature of our GLAM wiki ecosystem:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> – All tools on
wmcloud.org and
toolforge.org were knocked out
and
>>>>>> unavailable for 4 hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/cloud-announce@lists.wikimedia.…
>>>>>> – Petscan needed an extra hour before it came back, because it
is
>>>>>> not setup to run automatically, and needs a manual restart by
logging in as
>>>>>> Magnus and running a script by hand. This is a problematic
situation for
>>>>>> service deployment.
>>>>>> – Many tools rely on Petscan, such as GLAMorgan for expanding
>>>>>> category trees and generating Mediawiki page titles, so this
outage
>>>>>> affected many more tools
>>>>>> – BaGLAMa2 seems to have not come back successfully, as all the
>>>>>> categories that should be tracked are missing. Likely, the data
is all
>>>>>> there somewhere, but it currently needs some loving care to be
restored.
>>>>>> Unclear if this is being worked on.
>>>>>> – PAWS, the visual Python environment on wmcloud that is a
>>>>>> workhorse for bot work and scripts, is still down and needs some
loving
>>>>>> care to revive.
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T329581
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In short – we're trying to be scrappy and resourceful, but
we're
>>>>>> hurting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Andrew
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Feb 13, 2023 at 10:03 AM Andrew Lih
<andrew.lih(a)gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks all for the feedback and conversation.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In the meantime, has anyone gotten GLAMorgan to report back
any
>>>>>>> useful pageview data?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regardless of small, medium, or large categories, I keep
getting:
>>>>>>> "Data for ... pages could not be loaded from the WMF
pageview API
>>>>>>> (404 error)."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
https://glamtools.toolforge.org/glamorgan.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Andrew
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 9, 2023 at 10:10 AM Mary Mark Ockerbloom <
>>>>>>> celebration.women(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks for posting the fabricator ticket; I too have
subscribed.
>>>>>>>> I concur with others, lack of support for reliable tools
for
>>>>>>>> GLAM institutions has been a major concern for GLAMs for
many years.
>>>>>>>> Mary Mark Ockerbloom
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2023 at 5:41 PM Fiona Romeo
<fromeo(a)wikimedia.org>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks for adding your perspective, Dominic.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Here is the Phabricator ticket that tracks work the
Foundation
>>>>>>>>> has been doing with Wikimedia Israel to resolve
storage issues for the GLAM
>>>>>>>>> Wiki Dashboard:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T321702
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The conclusion was that it would be best for the
service to use
>>>>>>>>> the MediaRequest API, as Dominic has also recommended
in his email. Further
>>>>>>>>> to this, the Foundation's Data Platform team is
looking into a custom API
>>>>>>>>> endpoint for media requests by category to
reduce/remove the need for data
>>>>>>>>> transformation and storage. As an interim solution
for
>>>>>>>>> the GLAM Wiki Dashboard, we advised Wikimedia Israel
to migrate their
>>>>>>>>> project from Amazon Web Services to our own servers
and made
>>>>>>>>> capacity available for that.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We don't know as much about the BaGLAMa2 issues
at the moment.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm very sorry to see our GLAM wiki community
struggling with
>>>>>>>>> tool instability again.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fiona
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 8 Feb 2023 at 21:34, Dominic Byrd-McDevitt
<
>>>>>>>>> dominic(a)dp.la> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> For my part, I'd like to point out that these
issues are
>>>>>>>>>> recurring problems, and also that when it comes
to BaGLAMa lag, the longer
>>>>>>>>>> it goes, the more unrecoverable it becomes. Data
errors, once introduced,
>>>>>>>>>> are not repairable.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Dozens of the tracked categories in BaGLAMa are
DPLA
>>>>>>>>>> institutions, and I have shared these links
numerous times over the years.
>>>>>>>>>> So I frequently get questions from partners who
check their data and find
>>>>>>>>>> it months out of date. There is nothing I can
tell them in these
>>>>>>>>>> situations, except that I have regularly seen
data get that lagged, and
>>>>>>>>>> then eventually it reaches a point where
(presumably after someone finally
>>>>>>>>>> reached Magnus?) all the backlogged months come
in at once.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This causes its own problems, I believe, because
I have to
>>>>>>>>>> assume in such situations where data is generated
after the fact, that it
>>>>>>>>>> is all corrupt to some degree. My understanding
of BaGLAMa is that
>>>>>>>>>> it counts page views of articles using images
from a category. But there is
>>>>>>>>>> no MediaWiki log of when images were added to a
page (or to a category), so
>>>>>>>>>> if you are counting page views that occurred
three months ago based on
>>>>>>>>>> images that are in a page today, you might be
counting crediting three past
>>>>>>>>>> months with views for an image that was added
last week.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This issue causes massive data errors in the
other direction
>>>>>>>>>> too. Sometimes you'll have an unexplained
spike, like the several
>>>>>>>>>> here
>>>>>>>>>>
<https://glamtools.toolforge.org/baglama2/#gid=50&month=201611&giu=enwiki&server=en.wikipedia.org>
(and
>>>>>>>>>> by spike, I mean 700 million page views), and
it's caused by the fact that
>>>>>>>>>> an image that was on the main page for no more
than hours caused BaGLAMa to
>>>>>>>>>> count the entire month's page views of the
main page. These errors are
>>>>>>>>>> unrecoverable; they stay in the data and just
increase the error of the
>>>>>>>>>> overall total over time. There's never been a
time where I could go to a
>>>>>>>>>> maintainer and point out this massive data error
and get that rerun or
>>>>>>>>>> fixed. Instead, I am often in the embarrassing
position of telling partners
>>>>>>>>>> "Here is the analytics page, but there is a
big overcount on one random
>>>>>>>>>> month, so just always remember to mentally
subtract 100 million from your
>>>>>>>>>> total, and treat these numbers as very
inexact."
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So as long as we are talking about BaGLAMa at
all, I do have
>>>>>>>>>> to point out that it is an entirely flawed tool
and the data is unreliable.
>>>>>>>>>> And aside from all of those bugs, the methodology
is very flawed, since it
>>>>>>>>>> should not be using the Pageviews API in the
first place. I consider the
>>>>>>>>>> data essentially fictitious anyway— we know the
images we are tracking are
>>>>>>>>>> probably not even receiving half of the article
views we are crediting to
>>>>>>>>>> them, but we continue to report bad data, because
our projects rely
>>>>>>>>>> on having outcomes and reporting analytics.
Glamorous and Glamorgan are
>>>>>>>>>> based on the same flawed methodology.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And I haven't even started on the clunky UI,
where an
>>>>>>>>>> ever-growing list of 1000+ categories are all
displayed on the landing
>>>>>>>>>> page, many of which are typos or non-existent
categories that can never be
>>>>>>>>>> removed or cleaned up.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I guess my main point here is that no amount of
band aids will
>>>>>>>>>> ever resolve some of the issues, and we need to
be thinking about entirely
>>>>>>>>>> redoing the tool itself. Or we should have
already done so as soon as the
>>>>>>>>>> Mediarequests API was released—which was in
2019.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>>>>>> Dominic
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2023 at 6:50 AM Fiona Romeo <
>>>>>>>>>> fromeo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for escalating these specific issues
to us. Giovanna
>>>>>>>>>>> and I were both travelling in January so we
haven't been as active in
>>>>>>>>>>> Telegram.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Are you aware of anyone else having issues
with the GLAM Wiki
>>>>>>>>>>> Dashboard, or is it just The MET? I quickly
sampled some of the
>>>>>>>>>>> institutions and only saw a "bad
request" for The MET. We have been
>>>>>>>>>>> directly supporting Wikimedia Israel to
optimise their service, so I will
>>>>>>>>>>> raise this issue with both Wikimedia Israel
and the Foundation team that
>>>>>>>>>>> has some familiarity with their service.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I noted these two BaGLAMa2 issues in the
Telegram chat:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
https://bitbucket.org/magnusmanske/magnustools/issues/49/baglama-not-up-to-…
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
https://bitbucket.org/magnusmanske/magnustools/issues/50/baglama-not-adding…
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Are there other BaGLAMa2 reports we should be
aware of?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Metrics are definitely understood to be a
priority for the
>>>>>>>>>>> Foundation and I heard yesterday that metrics
tools rose to the top in
>>>>>>>>>>> Wikimedia Sweden’s survey too. There will be
opportunities to discuss this
>>>>>>>>>>> further in the context of annual planning but
I will see what can be done
>>>>>>>>>>> in the short term.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> More soon,
>>>>>>>>>>> Fiona
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 8 Feb 2023 at 10:57, Andrew Lih
<andrew.lih(a)gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi WREN and GLAM folks,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I need your insights into what could be a
very problematic
>>>>>>>>>>>> year for us in the GLAM wiki community,
as our metrics tools to measure our
>>>>>>>>>>>> impact are in crisis and disrepair. If
you have any insights, please do
>>>>>>>>>>>> share them here, or in the GLAM Wiki
Telegram group where this conversation
>>>>>>>>>>>> started happening recently.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I sent a "HELP!" message to the
Wikimedia SE content
>>>>>>>>>>>> partnerships help desk just the other
day, included below, and hope this
>>>>>>>>>>>> may be useful to start a conversation. If
there is enough interest, we
>>>>>>>>>>>> might want to start a wiki page to
formally document our needs as a GLAM
>>>>>>>>>>>> wiki community. Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Andrew
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ----
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: help(a)wikimedia.se
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd like to formally employ the
Helpdesk's services in
>>>>>>>>>>>> getting some care and attention to
BaGLAMa2. It seems to have been failing
>>>>>>>>>>>> since the end of last year, and even
then, it was reporting extremely low
>>>>>>>>>>>> figures for all categories. This is one
of the few tools we have in the
>>>>>>>>>>>> GLAM wiki community to measure impact and
to make the case for sustaining
>>>>>>>>>>>> our work.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
https://glamtools.toolforge.org/baglama2/
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Without these basic metrics, 2023 could
prove to be a
>>>>>>>>>>>> disastrous year for continuing efforts.
So far, we have been unable to
>>>>>>>>>>>> report good, reliable numbers to folks
such as the Metropolitan Museum of
>>>>>>>>>>>> Art or the Smithsonian Institution. Other
on-demand tools such as Glamorgan
>>>>>>>>>>>> usually cannot handle such large category
trees, and also have their own
>>>>>>>>>>>> problems with not being able to read the
pageviews API numbers accurately,
>>>>>>>>>>>> which is another issue in itself.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
https://glamtools.toolforge.org/glamorgan.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> In short - help! How can we get this on
the radar screen of
>>>>>>>>>>>> people who can put more care, attention,
and resources into this? Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Andrew
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> *Fiona Romeo* (she/her)
>>>>>>>>>>> Senior Manager, Culture and Heritage
>>>>>>>>>>> Wikimedia Foundation
<https://wikimediafoundation.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Wren mailing list -- wren(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to
wren-leave(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Wren mailing list -- wren(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to
wren-leave(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> -Andrew Lih
>>>>>>> Smithsonian Institution - Wikimedian at Large
>>>>>>> Metropolitan Museum of Art - Wikimedia strategist
>>>>>>> Previously: professor of journalism and communications,
American
>>>>>>> University, Columbia University, University of Southern
California
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> Email: andrew.lih(a)gmail.com, andrew(a)andrewlih.com
>>>>>>> WEB:
https://muckrack.com/fuzheado
>>>>>>> PROJECT: Wikipedia Space:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:WPSPACE
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> -Andrew Lih
>>>>>> Smithsonian Institution - Wikimedian at Large
>>>>>> Metropolitan Museum of Art - Wikimedia strategist
>>>>>> Previously: professor of journalism and communications, American
>>>>>> University, Columbia University, University of Southern
California
>>>>>> ---
>>>>>> Email: andrew.lih(a)gmail.com, andrew(a)andrewlih.com
>>>>>> WEB:
https://muckrack.com/fuzheado
>>>>>> PROJECT: Wikipedia Space:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:WPSPACE
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>> --
>> -Andrew Lih
>> Smithsonian Institution - Wikimedian at Large
>> Metropolitan Museum of Art - Wikimedia strategist
>> Previously: professor of journalism and communications, American
>> University, Columbia University, University of Southern California
>> ---
>> Email: andrew.lih(a)gmail.com, andrew(a)andrewlih.com
>> WEB:
https://muckrack.com/fuzheado
>> PROJECT: Wikipedia Space:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:WPSPACE
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wren mailing list -- wren(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to wren-leave(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>
>
--
*João Alexandre Peschanski | Usuário:JPeschanski (WMB)*
*Diretor Executivo | **Wiki Movimento Brasil*
*wmnobrasil.org <http://wmnobrasil.org/>*