Re: [Wikitech-l] pt.wikimedia.org - database naming - Wikitech-l

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New RFC: remove mbstring fallbacks

Deployment branch freeze next week...

Waldir Pimenta

24 Feb 2016 24 Feb '16

3:56 p.m.

Assuming there's no easy way to merge the databases, we are fine with dropping the old db. I believe most content was imported to the current wiki at the time of the migration, see https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T25537. An xml dump was used, not an SQL one, so I suppose stuff like logs may not have been preserved, but in any case it's not critical that we preserve all that historical info. I mean, it would certainly be nice, but we can live without it. Or we could use the pt2wikimedia, as that would allow future archeologists to recover the data from the beginning of the wiki :) Either option is fine. On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 12:13 PM, This, that and the other < at.light(a)live.com.au> wrote:

...

Why not just delete the old ptwikimedia site and put the new one in its place, using the same dbname? The old wiki is inaccessible, since pt.wikimedia.org redirects offsite, so it's unclear if the old DB even needs to be preserved. And presumably any configuration bits that refer to ptwikimedia will still be relevant to the new site. If for some reason that is not feasible, I guess pt2wikimedia is acceptable, though only as a last resort. As I've said before, there really needs to be a better way to rename wikis without wasting hours of everyone's time... TTO -- "Alex Monk" wrote in message news:CALMPGzX_E4ML0xD2A_2vTRZ+2a+nWtpC9KkJe58x=mdG-uOxEQ@mail.gmail.com... Hi all, A request has come up (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T126832) to re-create pt.wikimedia.org on the wikimedia cluster. Unfortunately it was previously hosted there and so the 'ptwikimedia' database name is already taken. Since database renaming does not really appear to be an option, does anyone have any objections to using 'pt2wikimedia' (or similar, suggestions welcome) instead for the new wiki? I know this doesn't fit the existing pattern so I'm unsure about just going ahead without asking for input from a wider audience. Alex _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Antoine Musso

24 Feb 24 Feb

4:18 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

Le 24/02/2016 14:56, Waldir Pimenta a écrit :

...

Hello, The ptwikimedia database being from 2012, I don't think there is much point in attempting to upgrade its schema, much less attempting to merge in the external db in. Given most of the useful data/history has been exported, I would suggest to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old or even just archive a dump of it and drop it. Then create a new ptwikimedia and import the external db there. I am an idealist, but I am afraid introducing a scheme like <lang>2<project type> is asking for various exceptions to be added in various code and will cause a nasty technical debt down the road. My 0.02 € -- Antoine "hashar" Musso

Jaime Crespo

5:23 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

...

I would suggest to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old

If you want this, I hope the users will have the patience to wait for when the renaming wikis bug will be solved in 2034. Or, you know, we can create *now* a new wiki with a new name that most users will not notice (it will not affect the domain name, pt.wikimedia.org). On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 3:18 PM, Antoine Musso <hashar+wmf(a)free.fr> wrote:

...

Le 24/02/2016 14:56, Waldir Pimenta a écrit :

-- Jaime Crespo <http://wikimedia.org>

Chad

5:42 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 7:23 AM Jaime Crespo <jcrespo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

I would suggest to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old

John

6:09 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

I dont want to come across as a dick, but renaming this wiki shouldn't be overly difficult. Worst case you dump the database and re-import under a new name. Since this is a non-active wiki all of the normal overhead isnt there. On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 10:42 AM, Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 7:23 AM Jaime Crespo <jcrespo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

I would suggest to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old

But there's not a wiki running there, just an old database. I imagine we could just rename the database (and associated external storage?). The move off-cluster predates RESTBase and Elasticsearch so no worries there. Any old memcached keys have long since expired too. -Chad _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Jeremy Baron

6:28 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 11:09 AM, John <phoenixoverride(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

yes, it should be a bit simpler because it is inactive. but AIUI, the big hurdle is not in renaming the DB but in renaming the externalstore. (and idk how that's laid out so I'll leave it to others to elaborate) -Jeremy

Legoktm

8:39 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

Hi, On 02/24/2016 06:18 AM, Antoine Musso wrote:

...

Given most of the useful data/history has been exported, I would suggest to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old or even just archive a dump of it and drop it. Then create a new ptwikimedia and import the external db there.

Alchimista

3 Mar 3 Mar

1:34 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

Any update on this? 2016-02-24 18:39 GMT+00:00 Legoktm <legoktm.wikipedia(a)gmail.com>om>:

...

Hi, On 02/24/2016 06:18 AM, Antoine Musso wrote:

I think reusing the "ptwikimedia" db name would be ideal. My only concern with doing so is that it might be in databases somewhere, but I checked CentralAuth and there are no ptwikimedia entries, so at least that will be fine. -- Legoktm _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

-- Alchimista http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilizador:Alchimista

Alex Monk

4:16 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

...

Any update on this? 2016-02-24 18:39 GMT+00:00 Legoktm <legoktm.wikipedia(a)gmail.com>om>:

Hi, On 02/24/2016 06:18 AM, Antoine Musso wrote: > Given most of the useful data/history has been exported, I would

suggest

to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old or even just archive a dump of it and drop it. Then create a new ptwikimedia and import the external db there.

-- Alchimista http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilizador:Alchimista _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Waldir Pimenta

10:15 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

Well, the conversation stalled in a way that made it unclear (to me at least) who can decide what option to choose (rename the db, if that's at all viable, or start a new wiki using pt2wikimedia, if that's acceptable, or something else). Is there anything we from Wikimedia Portugal can do or say to help move this forward? On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:16 PM, Alex Monk <krenair(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

Any update on this? 2016-02-24 18:39 GMT+00:00 Legoktm <legoktm.wikipedia(a)gmail.com>om>:

Hi, On 02/24/2016 06:18 AM, Antoine Musso wrote: > Given most of the useful data/history has been exported, I would

suggest

to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like ptwikimedia_old or even just archive a dump of it and drop it. Then create a new ptwikimedia and import the external db there.

_______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Alex Monk

4 Mar 4 Mar

12:43 a.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

It's not clear to me either. No, and I don't feel like I should make this (irreversible) decision. Sorry. On 3 March 2016 at 20:15, Waldir Pimenta <waldir(a)email.com> wrote:

...

I'm not sure what you're expecting, Alchimista. I haven't received any extra emails on the subject beyond those from the Phabricator task and those on this list. On 3 March 2016 at 11:34, Alchimista <alchimistawp(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Any update on this? > > 2016-02-24 18:39 GMT+00:00 Legoktm <legoktm.wikipedia(a)gmail.com>om>: > > > Hi, > > > > On 02/24/2016 06:18 AM, Antoine Musso wrote: > > > Given most of the useful data/history has been exported, I would > suggest > > > to rename on WMF cluster the ptwikimedia DB to something like > > > ptwikimedia_old or even just archive a dump of it and drop it. > > > > > > Then create a new ptwikimedia and import the external db there. > > > > I think reusing the "ptwikimedia" db name would be ideal. My only > > concern with doing so is that it might be in databases somewhere,

but I

checked CentralAuth and there are no ptwikimedia entries, so at least that will be fine. -- Legoktm _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Bartosz Dziewoński

2:38 a.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

You should just name it pt2wikimedia. We already have databases that don't match domain names and they're fine. -- Bartosz Dziewoński

Alchimista

17 Mar 17 Mar

10:15 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

If pt2.wikimedia should be used in last resource, can't the current db content be exported, and the db cleaned to be used again like sugested before? Exported content could be imported to a new db, lets say, pt.wikimedia.org_old. Is this feasible? Llegoktm already pointed that there are no entries on CentralAuth, since the wiki was shut down on 2011 / 2012, is there any other places to check? 2016-03-04 0:38 GMT+00:00 Bartosz Dziewoński <matma.rex(a)gmail.com>om>:

...

You should just name it pt2wikimedia. We already have databases that don't match domain names and they're fine. -- Bartosz Dziewoński _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

-- Alchimista http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilizador:Alchimista

Jaime Crespo

18 Mar 18 Mar

9:55 a.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 9:15 PM, Alchimista <alchimistawp(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

Llegoktm already pointed that there are no entries on CentralAuth, since the wiki was shut down on 2011 / 2012, is there any other places to check?

Content of every row of every other database that references ptwikimedia through links, notifications, file usage, content reference, global permissions or banner, or common content repositories, including tables that are created or modified by any mediawiki extension that exists or existed at some point on the Wikimedia infrastructure and that it wasn't properly cleaned up on uninstall.

Chad

3:51 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 12:55 AM Jaime Crespo <jcrespo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 9:15 PM, Alchimista <alchimistawp(a)gmail.com> wrote:

Llegoktm already pointed that there are no entries on CentralAuth,

since

the wiki was shut down on 2011 / 2012, is there any other places to

check? Content of every row of every other database that references ptwikimedia through links, notifications, file usage, content reference, global permissions or banner, or common content repositories, including tables that are created or modified by any mediawiki extension that exists or existed at some point on the Wikimedia infrastructure and that it wasn't properly cleaned up on uninstall.

Interwiki link existence isn't checked or tracked. File stuff isn't a problem (since ptwikimedia wasn't a central repo & existed prior to GlobalUsage being a thing). Cross-wiki notifications didn't exist either. Banners? Doesn't make sense. Pre-elasticsearch too so no conflicts. The *only* thing I can think of that could cause a problem is external storage. We should stop being paranoid and just try it :) -Chad

Jaime Crespo

3:59 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

^Am I seeing a volunteer to take ownership of this task (and its potential problems)? -- Jaime Crespo <http://wikimedia.org>

Chad

4 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 6:59 AM Jaime Crespo <jcrespo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com> wrote:

^Am I seeing a volunteer to take ownership of this task (and its potential problems)?

Well looks like nobody else is going to do it, so sure. -Chad

Jaime Crespo

4:09 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com> wrote:

...

Well looks like nobody else is going to do it, so sure. -Chad

It is always nice to see deployment issues being handled by deployment people. -- Jaime Crespo <http://wikimedia.org>

Chad

4:10 p.m.

New subject: pt.wikimedia.org - database naming

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 7:09 AM Jaime Crespo <jcrespo(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Chad <innocentkiller(a)gmail.com> wrote:

Well looks like nobody else is going to do it, so sure. -Chad

It is always nice to see deployment issues being handled by deployment people.

It helps that I'm a jack of all trades and a master of none so I can help with DB stuff too :) -Chad

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participants (10)

Alchimista
Alex Monk
Antoine Musso
Bartosz Dziewoński
Chad
Jaime Crespo
Jeremy Baron
John
Legoktm
Waldir Pimenta