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On Monday 02 January 2006 20:55, Ray Saintonge wrote:
Jon B wrote:
Stop being so hostile to people trying to improve the Wikipedia.
Do they unnecessarily load down the servers? Fine. Then they should
be killed, for now. (But don't call it "killing" and don't be an ass
about it.) Is the code obscene? Fine, but don't call it "obscene".
These people are just trying to help, in ways that you are unable or
unwilling to do. Be nice.
I agree. "Obscure" would be a much nicer term than "obscene"
As a programmer, I have to disagree. This code can only be called obscene
or worse things.
A frozen, glittering turd is still a turd, even though you use it
for-whatever because you got nothing else handy.
(Read: This doesn't imply anything about the people using these templates
except that instead of working towards a real solution they use (albeit
clever, one must admit) hacks. Read whatever you want into that :-)
So, we either throw these templates out and replace them with something
simpler something mere mortals can understand, or we risk a maintance
nightmare. If the template system isn't sufficient enough to that now,
* people overengeneer things, and/or do things that wikipedia isn't meant
to provide (read: E.g. it is a Enceclopedia, not a programming language
with a Web-IDE and embedded documentation system tacked on, nor a
database where you can represent arbitrarily complex data structures)
* OR, the software behind the scenes need to be improved to provide what
It is usualy a combination of the two, but by tackling stuff like the
aforemention template code on top of the system you do not solve the
underlying problem - instead, you create new issues like maintainance,
security, stability etc).
The complexity of wikipedia is reaching enourmous levels and anyone
unfamiliar with it will be quickly lost. I wouldn't even know which
templates to use or even exist, less alone be able to find my self in a
sea of recursive, conditional templates with a programming logic behind
So, I have to repeat myself:
* Wikipedia is an enceclopedia. It is not meant to be a database.
* Mixing code and data is the number #1 of all-times No-Nos.
Happy new Year to all, btw,
Signed on Mon Jan 2 21:22:18 2006 with key 0x93B84C15.
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