Message: 11
Date: 30 May 2004 17:10:00 +0200
From: erik_moeller(a)gmx.de (Erik Moeller)
Subject: Re: [Wikitech-l] Re: Klingon
To: wikitech-l(a)wikipedia.org
Message-ID: <99rqNUZSpVB@erik_moeller>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Timwi-
> Erik Moeller wrote:
>>> with the discussion clearly showing majority
support for the
Klingon
>>> Wikipedia, please can we finally re-enable it now?
>>
>> I see no such majority support.
> Are you blind?
>See my response to Peter - if your standards of
>listing people as "supporters" are the same as his,
>then I'm not surprised by the result. Furthermore,
>it is obvious that a page about artificial languages
>would primarily attract people interested in
>artificial languages, of which there are many on
>Wikipedia thanks to our generous policy with regard
>to conlangs. If you want to know if the majority of
>Wikipedia users supports Klingon or not, you will
>have to hold a well-publicized vote about it. This,
>or a compromise, is the only acceptable way out of
>the current impasse.
Hello Erik,
No offense, but I am not interested in artificial
languages, nor a trekkie. But if they want a wiki why
not?? I found the vote in the meta wiki by a
publication in the village pump on the en wiki, that
is publicized right???
Waerth (mainly nl wiki)
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On Monday, I'm planning to go into the colocation facility sometime
around noon my time (New York City time, Eastern time zone) to try to
upgrade to the 'ricky special' kernel to get DMA working on the
remainder of the older 1U machines.
To do this, I have to reboot the machines in turn, changing a bios
setting, and then booting into the proper kernel.
As I understand it, on the apaches when I do this, it will be more or
less seamless for website users.
But for other machines (zwinger, for example) it's more complex. What
should I do? Can someone help me?
--Jimbo
I have made a patch which enables display of all articles that belong to
multiple categories. Thus, for example, Category:Female/Orthodox/Saint would
return all female orthodox saints (that is, all articles which are
categorised with at least [[Category:Female]], [[Category:Orthodox]] and
[[Category:Saint]]).
I am not sure would this make for much greater database load, but that remains
to be seen in practice. Line if(strchr($t,"/")) { and corresponding else
block are actually not needed but I have left them because I figure that
display of a single category is slightly faster this way, and that at that
point it would be easier to turn off this feature if needed. It should also
be easy to limit to number of categories if that turns out to be neccesary.
Index: Parser.php
===================================================================
RCS file: /cvsroot/wikipedia/phase3/includes/Parser.php,v
retrieving revision 1.135
diff -u -3 -p -r1.135 Parser.php
--- Parser.php 15 May 2004 00:29:07 -0000 1.135
+++ Parser.php 30 May 2004 09:11:00 -0000
@@ -318,7 +318,21 @@ class Parser
# FIXME: add limits
$t = wfStrencode( $this->mTitle->getDBKey() );
- $sql = "SELECT DISTINCT cur_title,cur_namespace FROM
cur,categorylinks WHERE cl_to='$t' AND cl_from=cur_id ORDER BY cl_sortkey" ;
+ $t = preg_replace("'/+'","/",$t);
+ if(strchr($t,"/")) {
+ $ta = explode("/",$t);
+ $tt="cur"; $tw="";
+
+ $i=0;
+ foreach($ta as $v) {
+ $tt.=",categorylinks as cl$i";
+ $tw.="cl$i.cl_to='$v' AND
cl$i.cl_from=cl".++$i.".cl_from AND ";
+ }
+ $tw=preg_replace("' AND
cl[0-9]+[.]cl_from=cl[0-9]+[.]cl_from AND $'U","",$tw);
+ $sql="SELECT DISTINCT cur_title,cur_namespace FROM $tt
WHERE $tw AND cl0.cl_from=cur_id ORDER BY cl0.cl_sortkey";
+ } else {
+ $sql = "SELECT DISTINCT cur_title,cur_namespace FROM
cur,categorylinks WHERE cl_to='$t' AND cl_from=cur_id ORDER BY cl_sortkey" ;
+ }
$res = wfQuery ( $sql, DB_READ ) ;
while ( $x = wfFetchObject ( $res ) ) $data[] = $x ;
Please don't run disk-intensive processes on zwinger, especially while
we've got the crappy disk performance. The apaches slow to a crawl when
somebody decides they've got to munge a few gigs of log files or
whathaveyou and they can't get to the files on NFS.
I've disabled the webalizer job (again) and updatedb (which were
scheduled to run at about the same time, making things extra bad).
-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)
"Timwi" <timwi(a)gmx.net> schrieb:
> Erik Moeller wrote:
>
> >>It looks like this is an impasse only for you Erik. From
> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Multilingual_coordination#Starting_a_
> >>new_language_wikipedia
> >
> > These guidelines were written in 2001
>
> Irrelevant. They have not been abolished, therefore they are in effect.
Read the exact text.
It does NOT say, "A language that has 5 to 10 people should be created."
It does ALSO NOT say, "A language without 5 to 10 people should not be created."
It JUST says, "IF you start a language, try to get 5 to 10 people."
It MIGHT also say, "IF you don't have 5 to 10 people, reconsider whether you
want to create the language."
Given that these guidelines do not say anything, or at least do not say much,
about which languages should or should not be created, their relevance in this
debate is trivial at best. These are not guidelines on what languages we do or
do not want. These are guidelines on how to best set up a language.
> Rubbish. It is perfectly fair and correct. Other than your artificial
> distinction, there is no intrinsic difference between a natural language
> and a constructed language other than being natural and constructed,
> respectively. You seem to be assuming that constructed languages have
> some sort of lesser status or little validity. Stop thinking that. It's
> ridiculous.
It's not. A language is in the first place a means of communication, and
a Wikipedia is in the first place a means of distributing knowledge.
Something is clearly won by getting an article that exists in one
language in another language as well (or a different article on the
same subject) - it provides the information for those who speak the
second language while not speaking or being less fluent in the first.
I'm not convinced that the same holds for a language to Klingon. Is
there really interest in people to get their information in Klingon?
Or is it just there for fun, because one wants to write or read
'something' rather than something specific in Klingon?
Andre Engels
"Timwi" <timwi(a)gmx.net> schrieb:
> There was no dictatorial decree nor a vote which justified the creation
> of Toki Pona. There would have been prior objections, had the idea been
> brought up before its creation.
Actually, the idea _was_ brought up before its creation, and there _was_
a prior objection from yours humbly, although not worded as strongly as
the objections after creation were.
Andre Engels
The system appears to be down.
Error message:
*Warning*: main(extensions/wikihiero/wikihiero.php): failed to open
stream: No such file or directory in
*/usr/local/apache/common-local/php-new/includes/Parser.php* on line *6*
*Fatal error*: main(): Failed opening required
'extensions/wikihiero/wikihiero.php'
(include_path='/usr/local/apache/common/php-new:/usr/local/apache/common/php-new/includes:/usr/local/apache/common/php-new/PHPTAL-NP-0.7.0/libs:/usr/local/apache/common/php-new/languages:/usr/local/apache/common/php-new/templates:/usr/local/apache/common/php-new/extensions/wikihiero')
in */usr/local/apache/common-local/php-new/includes/Parser.php* on line *6
*
...from the onset one of the two options is accepted:
*Wikiquette as practiced on the other language sites is practiced the same
way there; or
*All behavior on klingon.wikipedia.org is unique to it, & any rules or
agreements concernign what is permitted does not apply anywhere else.
My reason for this is simple: the image we have of the Klingons is that
they are an aggressive, warrior species. I can't recall any description
of how their scholars/researchers/academics behave; for all I know, the
Klingon term for "tenured college professor" can be best translated as
"he with the sharpest batleth". (And take a look at the Klingon programmer's
rules both as a possible source for inspiration, & for a good laugh.)
The point isn't how I think Klingons behave, it's that we may find some
new editors come to the Klingon Wikipedia thinking that since flamewars,
inflexibility, & Denial of Service attacks is how "real" academic Klingons
would do, then they should act the same way. And carry this obnoxious
behavior into the rest of Wikipedia.
I don't care what the decision about Klingon Wikiquette is; it might be a
good thing if all of the editors go about their contributions with the goal
of leaving a trail of the bodies of their opponents as they go about their
work, because that way the Arbitration Committees of the other Wikipedias
could use the option of banishing problem Wikipedians to the Klingon
Wikipedia as a solution for some disputes. But in either case, I don't want
any disruptions to seep from it into our other communities.
</mode=grumpy>
Geoff