I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
To explain why bother:
As it stands, oldwikisource is almost invisible. It can't be linked via interwiki and it is not, as far as I can tell, supported by Wikidata (this was partly prompted by trying to get its author pages linked up properly). Lots of people don't even realise it's there. Oldwikisource gets almost no traffic or attention.
"Mul" is the correct ISO-639 code for "Multiple languages", just like "en" means "English", "fr" means "French" and so on. Several people already refer to the project with the shorthard "mul.ws". (For the record, the other official no-specific-language language-codes are "mis" for uncoded languages and "und" for undetermined).
I know there is a bugziilla request (52971) to catch interwiki links to unused subdomains and redirect them to either the incubator, betawikiversity or oldwikisource. That might solve some of this, but not the following:
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on English Wikisource and the same may hold elsewhere. Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator; it could be the primary project for works like this. It would also leave the subdomain-less page as a language portal, like most of the other projects, and let mul.ws have a proper main page (presumably linking to all of its other main pages but still a viable page in its own right).
However, I don't know if this is really a good idea, if it would have any support, or if it would be too difficult to be worth doing.
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting
oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on English
Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
I strongly support Adam's idea, and I add that a mul-wikisource could the perfect site to collect best coding/formatting standards and ideas, scripts, modules and templates to share them; this could be a great help for minor wikisource projects and an incouragement to KISS and to standardize practices for the major ones.
Really, my personal dream would be a unique, multilanguage wikisource just as there's a unique, multilanguage media container: Commons, and an unique, multilanguage container for structured data, Wikidata, for identical reasons; but this - I presume - can't be realized any more. What can be realized is, to remove any discouragement to upload into oldwikisource books in any language, to add a mul prefix so that books can be freely interlinked and to encourage to upload there multilanguage books.
Here: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Multilanguage_worksI told about some time ago.
Alex brollo
2014-03-13 22:37 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nicolas@gmail.com:
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting
oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on English
Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
I support Adam's idea too! Since mul.ws would be a project that affects all languages (or at least those who would want to use it to store their multilingual works), we could create a discussion page about this, and ask both the editors of oldwikisource and the members of the Wikisource User Group to give feedback about the move oldwikisource->mul.
That way wikidata could be deployed earlier without having to wait for an implementation that might take a looong time to happen.
Micru
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:25 PM, Alex Brollo alex.brollo@gmail.com wrote:
I strongly support Adam's idea, and I add that a mul-wikisource could the perfect site to collect best coding/formatting standards and ideas, scripts, modules and templates to share them; this could be a great help for minor wikisource projects and an incouragement to KISS and to standardize practices for the major ones.
Really, my personal dream would be a unique, multilanguage wikisource just as there's a unique, multilanguage media container: Commons, and an unique, multilanguage container for structured data, Wikidata, for identical reasons; but this - I presume - can't be realized any more. What can be realized is, to remove any discouragement to upload into oldwikisource books in any language, to add a mul prefix so that books can be freely interlinked and to encourage to upload there multilanguage books.
Here: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Multilanguage_works I told about some time ago.
Alex brollo
2014-03-13 22:37 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nicolas@gmail.com:
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting
oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on English
Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
I support too. It will allow oldwikisource to share the same configuration as language-based Wikisources. But we should really ask sysadmins if it's possible.
Feel free to open a bug [1] asking if it's possible to move oldwikisource to mul.wikisource.org and to add it in the "wikisource" site group.
The second step would be to open a formal vote on oldWikisource.
Thomas
[1] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Wikimedia
Le 14 mars 2014 à 00:23, David Cuenca dacuetu@gmail.com a écrit :
I support Adam's idea too! Since mul.ws would be a project that affects all languages (or at least those who would want to use it to store their multilingual works), we could create a discussion page about this, and ask both the editors of oldwikisource and the members of the Wikisource User Group to give feedback about the move oldwikisource->mul.
That way wikidata could be deployed earlier without having to wait for an implementation that might take a looong time to happen.
Micru
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:25 PM, Alex Brollo alex.brollo@gmail.com wrote: I strongly support Adam's idea, and I add that a mul-wikisource could the perfect site to collect best coding/formatting standards and ideas, scripts, modules and templates to share them; this could be a great help for minor wikisource projects and an incouragement to KISS and to standardize practices for the major ones.
Really, my personal dream would be a unique, multilanguage wikisource just as there's a unique, multilanguage media container: Commons, and an unique, multilanguage container for structured data, Wikidata, for identical reasons; but this - I presume - can't be realized any more. What can be realized is, to remove any discouragement to upload into oldwikisource books in any language, to add a mul prefix so that books can be freely interlinked and to encourage to upload there multilanguage books.
Here: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Multilanguage_works I told about some time ago.
Alex brollo
2014-03-13 22:37 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nicolas@gmail.com:
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on English Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
-- Etiamsi omnes, ego non _______________________________________________ Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Please add my name to this pile-on as well! :)
Cheers, Craig
On 14 March 2014 09:23, David Cuenca dacuetu@gmail.com wrote:
I support Adam's idea too! Since mul.ws would be a project that affects all languages (or at least those who would want to use it to store their multilingual works), we could create a discussion page about this, and ask both the editors of oldwikisource and the members of the Wikisource User Group to give feedback about the move oldwikisource->mul.
That way wikidata could be deployed earlier without having to wait for an implementation that might take a looong time to happen.
Micru
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:25 PM, Alex Brollo alex.brollo@gmail.comwrote:
I strongly support Adam's idea, and I add that a mul-wikisource could the perfect site to collect best coding/formatting standards and ideas, scripts, modules and templates to share them; this could be a great help for minor wikisource projects and an incouragement to KISS and to standardize practices for the major ones.
Really, my personal dream would be a unique, multilanguage wikisource just as there's a unique, multilanguage media container: Commons, and an unique, multilanguage container for structured data, Wikidata, for identical reasons; but this - I presume - can't be realized any more. What can be realized is, to remove any discouragement to upload into oldwikisource books in any language, to add a mul prefix so that books can be freely interlinked and to encourage to upload there multilanguage books.
Here: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Multilanguage_works I told about some time ago.
Alex brollo
2014-03-13 22:37 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nicolas@gmail.com:
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting
oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on
English Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
-- Etiamsi omnes, ego non
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Just to give a minimal contribution to oldwikisource revitalization, I opened there this stub about recent itwikisource experience: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource_vision_development/Internet_Archive
I hope (even if time is so limited!) to tell there about a deeper relationship IA-wikisource, that could pop out from recent activities and that could be inspiring for other wikisource users.
Alex
2014-03-14 12:59 GMT+01:00 Craig Franklin cfranklin@halonetwork.net:
Please add my name to this pile-on as well! :)
Cheers, Craig
On 14 March 2014 09:23, David Cuenca dacuetu@gmail.com wrote:
I support Adam's idea too! Since mul.ws would be a project that affects all languages (or at least those who would want to use it to store their multilingual works), we could create a discussion page about this, and ask both the editors of oldwikisource and the members of the Wikisource User Group to give feedback about the move oldwikisource->mul.
That way wikidata could be deployed earlier without having to wait for an implementation that might take a looong time to happen.
Micru
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:25 PM, Alex Brollo alex.brollo@gmail.comwrote:
I strongly support Adam's idea, and I add that a mul-wikisource could the perfect site to collect best coding/formatting standards and ideas, scripts, modules and templates to share them; this could be a great help for minor wikisource projects and an incouragement to KISS and to standardize practices for the major ones.
Really, my personal dream would be a unique, multilanguage wikisource just as there's a unique, multilanguage media container: Commons, and an unique, multilanguage container for structured data, Wikidata, for identical reasons; but this - I presume - can't be realized any more. What can be realized is, to remove any discouragement to upload into oldwikisource books in any language, to add a mul prefix so that books can be freely interlinked and to encourage to upload there multilanguage books.
Here: https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Multilanguage_worksI told about some time ago.
Alex brollo
2014-03-13 22:37 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nicolas@gmail.com :
2014-03-13 22:26 GMT+01:00 Adam Morgan wikisorcery@gmail.com:
I've been wondering: is there any benefit in actually getting
oldwikisource moved to the "mul" language subdomain? Also, how hard would this be? Would it be more effort than is worth making (or worth requesting that someone else makes, anyway)?
It sounds like a good idea (and I think it has been already discussed somewhere) but I don't know about the technic part/feasibility.
[snip]
There have been some objections to hosting a bilingual book on
English Wikisource
Do you have some URLs about that. It's seems pretty illogical to me. On all the other wikisources, there is bilingual books (and trilingual, quadrilingual, etc. multilingual books). On the breton wikisource, nearly 50% of the 145 books are bilingual ; moving them on old/ mul.ws would be a damn loss :(
Mul.ws could operate as more than just an incubator
Oldwikisource is already more than just an incubator ;)
Cdlt, ~nicolas
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
-- Etiamsi omnes, ego non
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Wikisource-l mailing list Wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org