How easy, for someone who has not studied it! Do you notice the length of
the list yourself? And though near-identical dialects in different spellings
might be mutually understood, it becomes a different thing when you talk
about divergent dialects. I say that the wide differences between several
Low Saxon variants *in combination with* the differences in spelling make
the possibility of a Wikipedia a valuable one.
W.
Also, the difference in spelling is easily solved.
Differences, as far as I know:
(German spelling -> Dutch spelling)
Final nn -> n
s -> z
i -> ie
o -> ao
au -> aau
ei -> aai
u -> oe/o
f -> v
ü -> u
mm -> m
a -> aa
ee -> eei
ou -> oe
ä -> ae / e
ö -> eu/ui
ll -> l
ou -> oou
w -> v/w
oo -> o
gg -> g
chC -> gC
uhi -> oei
Spelling can easily be converted, see
http://s87257573.onlinehome.us/ks/index.php?title=Nds-test&variant=ks-de
(obviously there are some shortcomings, but these can be fixed with a
little programming).
Mark
On 26/06/05, Mark Williamson <node.ue(a)gmail.com> wrote:
So, are you saying that a man from Lars cannot
understand a man from
Gramsbergen??
Of course, this must be so, since the man from Lars speaks "German Low
Saxon" and the man from Gramsbergen speaks "Dutch Low Saxon"... since
of course languages always follow exactly political divisions.
Mark
On 26/06/05, Wouter Steenbeek <musiqolog(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
> >As I noted before, it is a dialect continuum.
> All of the continental West Germanic language variants form a dialect
> continuum, with the possible exception of the Frisian tongues.
> >Stellingwarfs and Middel-pommersch are surely not mutually
> >intelligible, but Grunnegers and Oostfreesk very well should be.
> Yes, so are Berlinic and High German. And East-Veluws and Dutch. But
> Grunnegers and Oostfreesk are not or barely mutually intelligible when
> written down, because of the different spellings.
>
> >You are foolishly dividing Platt by nations. This is illogical. If we
> >had an Oostfreesk Wikipedia, Grunnegers-speakers would surely
> >understand it and vice-versa, even though Grunnegers is in the
> >Netherlands and Oostfreesk is mostly in Germany.
>
> "Foolishly"... Mr. I-owe-all-the-world's-languages'-wisdom.... May
I
point
> at the difference in spelling once more? And
don't you think that the
bulk
> of the Dutch Low-Saxon dialects share some
features most German
dialects
> don't?
> >The problem of dialect continuum is a very difficult one.
> Yes, so it can't be solved by one such disregarding message.
> >HOWEVER, given the community reaction to a request for a Baseldytsch
> >Wikipedia, I think the same is logical for a request for a "Dutch Low
> >Saxon" Wikipedia
> Is it? Is Servien requesting a Wikipedia for just one town, or region?
No,
> she obviously realises that, though the
speaking communities hardly
link
> dialects on any higher level than their own
region (they will never
say they
> speak Low Saxon, but always either the
dialect of their own village or
> region, Twents, Sallands, Drents etc.), we should group some of them
> together. This is very different from what the proposer of the
Baseldytsch
> Wikipedia did: he simply said: "I have
no affinity with the other
Alemannic
> dialects, so I want to open one for my
dialect only".
> >-- your language may be different to whatever degree
> >than what many people on X Wikipedia use, but there is no rule
> >forbidding its use. There is no rule against writing pages and pages
> >and pages of content on nds.wiki in Stellingwarfs or Achterhooks.
When
> >I suggested doing this, I got a cold
response that Dutch Low Saxon
and
> >German Low Saxon aren't mutually
intelligible. Before whinging to us
> >about that, can you at least actually try to use your dialect on
> >nds.wiki to prove to us that it really doesn't work?
> Some users of nds: made clear that they only use one spelling: the
Sass one.
> Dutch Low Saxon dialects are /never/ written
in German spellings,
except
> with some German-initiated projects.
>
> >Mark
> >
> Imo, the combined facts of mutual confusion in both speach and
spelling
makes
this idea a valuable one.
Wouter
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