On 12/14/05, Gordon Joly gordon.joly@pobox.com wrote:
The current set of objects (a) to (e) has the following (final) object:
e) to campaign if necessary against impediments and restrictions to the above goals, wheresoever enacted, in the United Kingdom or overseas.
But the Charities Commission guidelines at
http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/publications/cc9.asp
state:
- However, where the campaign or other activity is of a political
nature (ie seeking to advocate or oppose a change in the law or public policy), charity trustees must ensure that these activities do not become the dominant means by which they carry out the purposes of the charity. These activities must remain incidental or ancillary to the charity's purposes.
Does the fact that one of our five objects (and a reference to the other four) give us explicit campaigning purpose and as hence as at odds with the above clause? See also the rest of "CC9"
CC9 - Campaigning and Political Activities by Charities (Version - September 2004)
I haven't read the above document(s), but the reason for this suggestion was that *if* we ever felt the need to campaign for a change in the law (in the UK or abroad), having this explicitly stated in the objects would allow us to do it. Campaigning will not be our predominant activity, so I still think we fit within the Charity Commision's guidelines.
Cormac
We need to find out (from our lawyer or from the Charities commission) if object e) would rule out our registration as a charity and if objects a) to d) give us implicit permission to campaign as an ancillary purpose without stating this. An alternative would be to make sure we have a catch all object "to engage in any activity to further the ..." if this is permitted.
Andreww
On 12/14/05, Cormac Lawler cormaggio@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/14/05, Gordon Joly gordon.joly@pobox.com wrote:
The current set of objects (a) to (e) has the following (final) object:
e) to campaign if necessary against impediments and restrictions to the above goals, wheresoever enacted, in the United Kingdom or overseas.
But the Charities Commission guidelines at
http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/publications/cc9.asp
state:
- However, where the campaign or other activity is of a political
nature (ie seeking to advocate or oppose a change in the law or public policy), charity trustees must ensure that these activities do not become the dominant means by which they carry out the purposes of the charity. These activities must remain incidental or ancillary to the charity's purposes.
Does the fact that one of our five objects (and a reference to the other four) give us explicit campaigning purpose and as hence as at odds with the above clause? See also the rest of "CC9"
CC9 - Campaigning and Political Activities by Charities (Version - September 2004)
I haven't read the above document(s), but the reason for this suggestion was that *if* we ever felt the need to campaign for a change in the law (in the UK or abroad), having this explicitly stated in the objects would allow us to do it. Campaigning will not be our predominant activity, so I still think we fit within the Charity Commision's guidelines.
Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimediauk-l mailing list Wikimediauk-l@Wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
At 11:49 +0000 14/12/05, Andrew Walker wrote:
We need to find out (from our lawyer or from the Charities commission) if object e) would rule out our registration as a charity and if objects a) to d) give us implicit permission to campaign as an ancillary purpose without stating this. An alternative would be to make sure we have a catch all object "to engage in any activity to further the ..." if this is permitted.
Andreww
Yes, I agree, we need a lawyer *before* we incorporate. We can claim some funds from the Foundation.
At 13:52 +0000 14/12/05, Gordon Joly wrote:
At 11:49 +0000 14/12/05, Andrew Walker wrote:
We need to find out (from our lawyer or from the Charities commission) if object e) would rule out our registration as a charity and if objects a) to d) give us implicit permission to campaign as an ancillary purpose without stating this. An alternative would be to make sure we have a catch all object "to engage in any activity to further the ..." if this is permitted.
Andreww
Yes, I agree, we need a lawyer *before* we incorporate. We can claim some funds from the Foundation.
I have made contact with a solicitor who can help is incorporate. I have sent him the URL: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK
The firm also an "IT and e-commerce" expertise, and are based in Central London.
Something like "to promote and advance the above goals through the provision of information in the UK or overseas" might suffice.
Political campaigning and charities is an interesting line. Plenty of charities campaign on issues related to their charitable objectives - eg Shelter emailed me recently to ask me to email the Chancellor, Terrence Higgins Trust wanted me to email my MP, Oxfam wanted me to support Tony Blair for the "Make Trade Fair"/Live 8 campaign - but the purpose of those campaigns must be to advance their charitable objectives.
Anything explicitly set up to overturn laws, or change Government policy, is poo-pooed by the Charity Commission - hence why political parties are not charities.
Amnesty is interesting - everything that can be a charity is (eg helping victims with medical aid), everything that can't, isn't. http://www.amnesty.org.uk/amnesty/aiukstructure.shtml
I agree though - a quick check over before incorporation is easier than after...
Regrettably, I only have a contract lawyer as a friend - good luck with the search for one more specialist.
Scott
On Wednesday, December 14, 2005, at 11:49 am, Andrew Walker wrote:
We need to find out (from our lawyer or from the Charities commission) if object e) would rule out our registration as a charity and if objects a) to d) give us implicit permission to campaign as an ancillary purpose without stating this. An alternative would be to make sure we have a catch all object "to engage in any activity to further the ..." if this is permitted.
Andreww
On 12/14/05, Cormac Lawler cormaggio@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/14/05, Gordon Joly gordon.joly@pobox.com wrote:
The current set of objects (a) to (e) has the following (final) object:
e) to campaign if necessary against impediments and restrictions to the above goals, wheresoever enacted, in the United Kingdom or overseas.
But the Charities Commission guidelines at
http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/publications/cc9.asp
state:
- However, where the campaign or other activity is of a political
nature (ie seeking to advocate or oppose a change in the law or public policy), charity trustees must ensure that these activities do not become the dominant means by which they carry out the purposes of the charity. These activities must remain incidental or ancillary to the charity's purposes.
Does the fact that one of our five objects (and a reference to the other four) give us explicit campaigning purpose and as hence as at odds with the above clause? See also the rest of "CC9"
CC9 - Campaigning and Political Activities by Charities (Version - September 2004)
I haven't read the above document(s), but the reason for this suggestion was that *if* we ever felt the need to campaign for a change in the law (in the UK or abroad), having this explicitly stated in the objects would allow us to do it. Campaigning will not be our predominant activity, so I still think we fit within the Charity Commision's guidelines.
Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimediauk-l mailing list Wikimediauk-l@Wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
Wikimediauk-l mailing list Wikimediauk-l@Wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
Scott Keir + scottkeir@yahoo.co.uk + 44(0)7811 266225 + I've moved to: 76 Longridge Road, London, SW5 9SQ +
___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org