Hi Fae,
Mike is correct, this is a British Library blog post, which discusses the
Royal Gold Cup, which is an item in the British Museum collections. However
the gold cup is mentioned in British Library manuscripts, hence the
connection and relevance, for including an image of the cup in the blog
post about the manuscripts.
I am not sure which British Library curator in the Medieval and Early
Modern Department has written this blog post, it may be written by a
collaborative PhD student from that section. I'm sure the post's author
would willingly add an attribution and a link to Wikimedia Commons, or
would you prefer your photograph to be removed from the post?
I can contact the Head of this Dept to ask.
I am trying to encourage my curatorial colleagues in the British Library
to add out of copyright BL digitised collections to Wikimedia Commons and
Wikisource.
I am also in the process of being able to hire a new Wikimedian in
Residence for the British Library (I've been arranging funding sources for
this), who will assist with staff training and guidance, building on from
the fabulous work that Andrew Gray did a few years ago.
So I am keen for my British Library colleagues to have good relations
with the Wikimedia community.
best wishes,
Stella
On Wed, 12 Aug 2020, 17:05 Michael Peel, <email(a)mikepeel.net> wrote:
Hi Fae,
The reuse seems to be by the British Library, not the British Museum,
here. Asking them for £400 seems a bit odd/steep (
https://twitter.com/Faewik/status/1293503130987122688).
Thanks,
Mike
On 12 Aug 2020, at 13:05, Fæ
<faewik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Lucy,
It's just over 3 months ago that your offer to talk with the British
Museum about claiming copyright over public domain images, and
consequently charging academics and other reusers large fees to use
images which should be free to the public. Has there been any progress
and what came of the plan to discuss this topic at the recent AGM?
As a further reference case study of the British Museum continuing
using what Wikimedians call "license laundering"[0], this week they
have claimed all rights reserved for my own photograph released on
Wikimedia Commons a decade ago to support Wikipedia editathons working
with the Museum, as CC-BY-SA.[1][2] The BM has removed EXIF data, and
not attempted to apply a simple attribution, or perhaps fail to
understand what is required to respect moral rights. A remarkable
failure considering the museum and their online presence sets the
standard for many other UK GLAM institutions.
Thanks,
Fae
Links
0.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:License_laundering
1.
https://web.archive.org/web/20200812105445/https://blogs.bl.uk/digitisedman…
2.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Royal_Gold_Cup_lid.jpg
--
faewik(a)gmail.com
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
----
On Thu, 30 Apr 2020 at 16:20, Lucy Crompton-Reid
<lucy.crompton-reid(a)wikimedia.org.uk> wrote:
>
> Dear all
>
>
> As a number of people have noted already, it is indeed disappointing
that the
British Museum has released these images under a non commercial
licence, given the obvious restrictions to people actually accessing and
using them. Whilst staff at Wikimedia UK have many partnerships within the
cultural sector, including larger institutions, the BM is not currently one
of them. However I will get in touch with them and point out the issues
with the licence they’ve chosen. If anyone has any contacts at the Museum
they would be able to share with me that would be very helpful - and of
course, you are also welcome to lobby them as individuals.
>
>
> I’m not sure that I quite agree with the characterisation of
Wikimedia UK as
“advocating for a position at variance with that of the
wider movement when it comes to claiming non commercial copyright on out of
copyright material”. Indeed, in a talk I gave at a Westminster Media Forum
policy event on the EU copyright directive last year, I said:
>
>
> “Access to and re-use of centuries old paintings, part of our
cultural
heritage, is being increasingly restricted by an array of laws and
in-house rules within cultural institutions aiming to maintain control of
their digital copies. This causes many classical works, for instance, to be
unavailable to the public online, despite them being part of the public
domain.
>
>
> Part of the social balance under copyright and related rights is that
at some
point the exclusive economic rights expire and the works become
part of our shared cultural heritage. This makes up a large portion of the
public domain and ensures wide access to our culture and the freedom to
create and innovate. Unfortunately, in the past decades we have seen
increasing attempts to restrict our cultural heritage by claiming copyright
on public domain works, or by establishing new rights on exact digital
copies of old works. These practices complicate and sometimes prevent the
digitisation of and digital access to our culture.
>
>
> The [EU copyright] Directive therefore provides for a safeguard of
public
domain works. We must make sure no new rights are applied to digital
copies of artworks whose copyright has expired. This includes both no
copyright term extension for such rules and no related rights. The current
situation in the UK on this is quite inconclusive, with works that would be
considered to be public domain under US law potentially subject to
copyright under UK law. Indeed the courts in the UK traditionally applied a
very low test for photographic originality, based on the "skill and labour"
required to capture the image. In the IPO’s updated copyright advice notice
in 2015, it acknowledges that there is a degree of uncertainty regarding
whether copyright can exist in digitised copies of older images for which
copyright has expired. However it also states that according to the Court
of Justice of the European Union, copyright can only subsist in subject
matter that is original in the sense that it is the author’s own
‘intellectual creation’. This higher standard should be unequivocally
applied to UK cultural heritage institutions, who might be inadvertently
engaging in copyfraud.”
>
>
> Previously, at a ministerial roundtable on the directive, I raised
this very
point with the Minister (at the time), who seemed completely
unaware of the practice of copyrighting digital reproductions of public
domain works, and remarked that this was certainly “outside of the spirit”
of existing law and proposed legislation. Both of those policy
interventions point to our general approach towards non-commercial licenses
and to issues around copyfraud.
>
>
> However it’s true that we do, as a chapter, work with a broad range
of
institutions, some of whom claim non commercial copyright on out of
copyright material. We challenge this where we see it, albeit usually
through meetings and discussions, rather than in public fora. Indeed, much
of our work with the cultural sector involves this kind of internal
advocacy, and we can see the impact of this in the institutions who go on
to change their policy and practice and release a substantial amount of
content onto open licences. We also continue to talk to grantmaking
organisations to encourage them to move away from non commercial licences
for themselves and their grantees - although again, we primarily do this in
collaboration/discussion rather than on a public forum. It’s probably fair
to say we take a carrot, rather than a stick, approach on this - but I
think that’s a question of tactics, rather than of policy.
>
>
> Having said all of that, I don’t want to shut down debate and would
be very
happy for there to be questions and discussions on this at our next
AGM (which is indeed going to be online, for reasons that are clearly
outside of our control). As a staff team we have recently started planning
this event, which is going to be on Saturday 18th July, and have already
started thinking about how we ensure the Q&A part of the day is as
productive and inclusive as possible, particularly given the unusual set up.
>
>
> To come back more specifically to the BM issue, I will follow this up
next
week. I think it will be relatively easy for me to find someone to
talk to there but as I say, if anyone does have an existing
contact/relationship at the museum I would be very pleased to hear from you.
>
>
> All best wishes
>
> Lucy
>
>
>
> On Thu, 30 Apr 2020 at 12:48, Harry Mitchell <hjmwiki(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>> I agree that it's only a matter of time before somebody does it but,
as with the NPG a few years ago, the BM are likely to be quite upset if we
can't get them to see it from our point of view. If anyone has any relevant
contacts it might be worth reaching out. It could be that they don't fully
understand the difference between CC-By-SA and CC-By-NC and how the latter
prevents use on Wikipedia. On the other hand, it could be that they're
claiming copyright based on the "sweat of brow" doctrine, which hasn't
been
fully tested in British courts.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 12:21 PM WereSpielChequers <
werespielchequers(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Andy makes some important points.
>>>
>>> We know that even if editors in the UK respect what the British
Museum
is doing and don't upload those images to Commons or Wikipedia;
where they are public domain images under US law, it is just a matter of
time before someone in the movement, anywhere in the world, uploads any of
those British Museum images that are of old two D objects to Commons as
Public Domain images that can be used without attribution to the
photographer or the institution.
>>>
>>> Of course large parts of the British Museum collection would
involve
images of three d objects. In those case we can't use the BM
images, but outside of lockdown people can either go there and take photos,
or if you can't get yourself to the British Museum with a camera, make a
request via the London Meetup, and if the object is on display we can get
results such as at
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniature_altarpiece_(WB.232)
>>>
>>>
>>> The chapter remains in the awkward position of liaising with
institutions that regard it as acceptable to claim a non commercial
copyright on out of copyright material, and of in effect advocating for a
position at variance with that of the wider movement.
>>>
>>> One option that the chapter could consider would be to shift policy
and instead start to diplomatically lobby UK Museum's to, as Andy put it,
stop " trying to appropriate rights that belong to us all." Perhaps those
on this list who are still members of the chapter might consider raising
this for a debate at the next AGM?
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Jonathan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 29 Apr 2020 at 21:06, Andy Mabbett <
andy(a)pigsonthewing.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 29 Apr 2020 at 11:43, Owen Blacker <owen(a)blacker.me.uk>
wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> That it's a non-commercial licence is really disappointing, but
that's still a little better than nothing…
>>>>
>>>> With the emphasis on the "little". There are two things wrong
with
>>>> this, which we as a movement (and individually) need to challenge;
at
>>>> very reasonable opportunity.
>>>>
>>>> Firstly, there's the way they're spending public money making
non-free
>>>> original content. we need to
persuade GLAMs - and lobby funders -
that
>>>> such material should be freely
reusable.
>>>>
>>>> But far more troubling is the attempt to claim copyright in works
>>>> whose copyright - if the work didn't pre-date copyright completely
-
>>>> expired decades or centuries ago.
The latter means, in effect that
>>>> they are trying to appropriate rights that belong to us all.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Andy Mabbett
>>>> @pigsonthewing
>>>>
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
> --
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