Hello there,
I came across this picture: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Magna_Carta.jpg while wandering around Commons.
The accredited source is the UK National Archives and as far as I understand this page: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/copyright.htm Reproductions of images on the website are not permitted without acquitting a fee.
However, I am not familiar with public domain policy stuff in the UK, it could be that there are twists I don't know about, so I am asking for some enlightenment as to whether this image should stay or go.
Thank you!
Delphine
On 07/12/06, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote: Hmm...
"The Crown copyright protected material (other than the Royal Arms and departmental or agency logos) may be reproduced free of charge in any format or medium provided it is reproduced accurately and not used in a misleading context."
That sounds about right...
"The exception to this rule is for material downloaded from our DocumentsOnline service (see below)."
Fair enough...
"Where any of the Crown copyright items on this site are being republished or copied to others, the source of the material must be identified and the copyright status acknowledged."
Again, fair enough, and standard procedure for us anyway.
"Images on this site may not be reproduced without payment of a fee to the image library."
That doesn't sound quite right to me; in fact, it contradicts the earlier Crown Copyright statement.
It might be worth firing off an email or making other enquiries to check, unless someone else here knows what's going on with these.
Rob Church
On 12/7/06, Rob Church robchur@gmail.com wrote:
On 07/12/06, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote: Hmm...
"The Crown copyright protected material (other than the Royal Arms and departmental or agency logos) may be reproduced free of charge in any format or medium provided it is reproduced accurately and not used in a misleading context."
That sounds about right...
"The exception to this rule is for material downloaded from our DocumentsOnline service (see below)."
Fair enough...
"Where any of the Crown copyright items on this site are being republished or copied to others, the source of the material must be identified and the copyright status acknowledged."
Again, fair enough, and standard procedure for us anyway.
"Images on this site may not be reproduced without payment of a fee to the image library."
That doesn't sound quite right to me; in fact, it contradicts the earlier Crown Copyright statement.
Crown Copyright is not a free lisence so we can't use Crown Copyright material in any case
It might be worth firing off an email or making other enquiries to check, unless someone else here knows what's going on with these.
I assume the uploader is relying on the fact that the copyright on the Magna Carta itself has long since expired (in fact it was never protected by copyright). However since this is far from being a slavish copy and elements of it are creative (placement of the string and seal at the bottem being the obvious ones) I think the UK National Archives can legitimately claim copyright even under US law and those the image should be deleted as a copyvio.
On 07/12/06, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote:
Hello there,
I came across this picture: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Magna_Carta.jpg while wandering around Commons.
The accredited source is the UK National Archives and as far as I understand this page: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/copyright.htm Reproductions of images on the website are not permitted without acquitting a fee.
However, I am not familiar with public domain policy stuff in the UK, it could be that there are twists I don't know about, so I am asking for some enlightenment as to whether this image should stay or go.
Bear in mind that we're not talking a copy of the text here (it's clearly too small to read), and we're not talking a copy of "an artwork", a creative artistic piece - this is a picture of a physical artifact, plain and simple, and I don't see any reason that the photograph itself shouldn't retain copyright.
Generally speaking, in the UK, you generally get copyright over a photograph if there are creative or skilled elements in the making of it - most things above an automatic photobooth, in fact. It's entirely debatable how far that applies to "archive" images which are sort-of intended as slavish copies and do require a lot of skilled work to create, but it's a digression from the point here.
This is an image that, to my mind, can be copyrighted same as any other. We're just being mislead by the fact it's of a textual artifact.
Best thing to do is, like Rob says, email the people to see what they say... - Gary Kirk
On 12/7/06, Andrew Gray shimgray@gmail.com wrote:
On 07/12/06, Delphine Ménard notafishz@gmail.com wrote:
Hello there,
I came across this picture: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Magna_Carta.jpg while wandering around Commons.
The accredited source is the UK National Archives and as far as I understand this page: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/copyright.htm Reproductions of images on the website are not permitted without acquitting a fee.
However, I am not familiar with public domain policy stuff in the UK, it could be that there are twists I don't know about, so I am asking for some enlightenment as to whether this image should stay or go.
Bear in mind that we're not talking a copy of the text here (it's clearly too small to read), and we're not talking a copy of "an artwork", a creative artistic piece - this is a picture of a physical artifact, plain and simple, and I don't see any reason that the photograph itself shouldn't retain copyright.
Generally speaking, in the UK, you generally get copyright over a photograph if there are creative or skilled elements in the making of it - most things above an automatic photobooth, in fact. It's entirely debatable how far that applies to "archive" images which are sort-of intended as slavish copies and do require a lot of skilled work to create, but it's a digression from the point here.
This is an image that, to my mind, can be copyrighted same as any other. We're just being mislead by the fact it's of a textual artifact.
--
- Andrew Gray andrew.gray@dunelm.org.uk
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