Brother Shahid, thanks for your comments, but for the record (and for
any other Indian Wikipedians who want to get things off their chest like
he did) please direct your criticism at me in the future, not the folks
who have worked incredibly hard over the last year to fashion the
bye-laws you see on Meta.
I've been on the Advisory Board of the Wikimedia Foundation since its
inception, towards the end of 2006. Like you, I'm an admirer and
supporter of the mission of Wikipedia, and of the work of the Wikimedia
Foundation. Over time, and with much subsequent interest from various
people within Wikimedia, it became clear that the lack of an Indian
chapter was an obstacle. An obstacle for Wikipedians like you; an
obstacle that prevented people in India from doing everything they could
to help Wikipedia grow. As there were several Wikipedians who wanted to
form a chapter but were seemingly unable to, between 2008 and 2009, I
contacted anyone who had previously expressed an interest in setting up
an Indian chapter. These are people who had interacted here on
WikimediaIndia-l, and also on meta, or who had written in to Cary Bass
at the Wikimedia Foundation in his capacity as volunteer coordinator.
The folks whose names you now see on the Indian chapter bye-laws are
those who stepped up from among a vast list to give roughly one year of
their time - a couple of hours a day, several hours a week, to make this
Was the process perfect? No. But was it a fair process, given the
options and constraints? Yes. Is the group of people that drafted the
MoA perfectly representative of the Indian Wikipedian community? No. But
are they as representative as was possible? Yes. Personally (and
everyone who has been associated with the Indian chapter will agree) I
don't believe we have enough Wikipedians from North India, or North-East
India; I also don't believe we have enough female Indian Wikipedians on
board. This is a pity; but this is also an opportunity, as long as it's
stated upfront - as I have in several emails to this list before - for
both increasing membership to the chapter from specific regions and from
women, and for reconstituting the legally required stewards of this
process from time to time with appropriately representative members. I
appreciate you pointing out the flaws. But I don't appreciate you
assuming that no one had considered these flaws before. And I would
appreciate you participating in a manner that can correct the imbalances
that exist in the ensuing Wikimedia India chapter, now and later.
The process, as you will understand, is complicated and there have been
several ups and downs. ChapCom (the Chapters Committee) has stringent
requirements; Indian tax law is complicated and rigorous to say the
least. This process also required money to host people from various
different cities in one place for a meeting, to hire an accountant, to
get constant legal and tax advice - and the organisation that stepped up
to fill this gap is a new and vibrant non-profit called the Centre for
Internet and Society (www.cis-india.org). We're now at that lucky stage
when our rules comply with everyone concerned. What the rules need,
however, is your input.
Now, while I appreciate your concern and criticism, can I ask you in
turn, why it is so easy to lash out with no restraint and so hard to
actually contribute positively? I don't see your input on the India
strategy (http://strategy.wikimedia.org/wiki/Task_force/India). I can't
see your input on meta
(http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_India/MoA). And this is
despite numerous messages, announcements and entreaties for
contribution. Everything I've written here in this email, I've written
before to WikimediaIndia-l, so this is not new, but you don't seem to
have been reading your messages. And you must start doing so.
There are several thousands of Wikipedians in India who want to help,
and not all of them are prolific editors, indeed some of them help in
other ways, and we should welcome them all, while realising the
invaluable role that editors play in making this thing we love. You are
scaring them away - and I am pointing this out because I don't think you
want to; you wouldn't be on this list if you didn't want to help make
I ask that you please join us in this exciting new phase for Wikimedia
in India. Like you, I plan to apply for membership of the society as
soon as the India chapter commences, and like you - I hope - I plan to
submit my ideas on what the India chapter should do. Perhaps we will
even meet in person. I'm actually very fond of wining and dining, and it
would be my pleasure to show you some hospitality in the Wikimedia way:
I promise to buy you a plate of idlis and a glass of water the next time
we're in the same city.
Its great to see that there has been some concrete efforts to establish the
Indian Chapter of Wikimedia Foundation. After many years of repeated
efforts, its good to see that we are close to fruitition. There is a strong
team with diverse background and rich involvement in Wikipedia working on
this. While I was initially part of this effort, I'm no longer involved
with the formation of the foundation. There are times I overran myself in
the assumption that Foundation formation time could happen sooner and
assumed I'd be part of the board and hence a Director (designate) without
realizing the really long gestation period it takes to set up the foudation
or the confusion it would cause. In this regard, I apologise to the entire
Wikipedia India community.
I will continue to be associated with helping out with Wikipedia outreach
and the concept of Open Knowledge on a personal level. This year, I'll help
in organizing Creative Commons Salon (bringing in artists who believe in
open creativity), Wikipedia Academy ( to teach people who interested in
contributing but dont know how) and WikiCamp (an unconference that will aim
to tap into the concept of collective wisdom using wikis, and not just
Wikipedia). I recently published a book 'Wikipedia : A beginners' Guide'
which is completely on a CC license. I seek help in translating this into
mulitple Indian languages and freely distribute this to school libraries in
towns and villages. Any help in this regard would be highly welcome. All
these activies are done as a volunteer without assuming any formal positions
and look forward to contributing actively. I can be reached at 98415 97744
and at Kiruba(a)Kiruba.com. Thanks in advance.
Cell: +91-0-98415 97744
Personal Blog: http://Kiruba.com
after sending this mail, I got the mails that I said were missing except the original mail by Praveen Prakash. Strange that newer mails come into the inbox before the older mails.
Unified login across all Wikimedia projects: Gurubrahma
From: guru brahma <wikibra(a)yahoo.co.in>
Sent: Thu, 11 March, 2010 6:56:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] Wikimedia India Chapter
I haven't received some of the mails on this mailing list and I had to check back on the mail server to see those mails - the two mails by Praveen Prakash and the reply to one of them from Sundar and two mails from Shiju Alex are the ones I can recall quickly. I had to go back to the server as I missed the continuity. Does it have to do with some code in the messages? - I could not find them even in my bulk/ spam/ trash folders.
Anyway, given that Meta is the coordination project for all Wikimedia projects, may I suggest that all the queries be directed at the relevant talkpages on Meta? The advantage is that it is easier to search, identify and track through history pages and the entire discussion is centralised at one place instead of multiple locations like this mailing list, IRC or telephone chats. Another advantage is that a user's comments stay there till perpetuity - letting us know his/ her perspectives and viewpoints over the years and the evolution therein. Hence, I suggest we start discussing the Wikimedia India Chapter at either of http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_India/MoA or http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_India. I, for one, would answer all the questions put forth to me on that forum.
Thanks for all the support and encouragement.
Unified login across all Wikimedia projects: Gurubrahma
P.S. It may not be a bad idea for all of us using the mailing list to give our primary wikispace or unified login at the end of each message we send - I shd probably make it my signature.
From: Hari Prasad Nadig <hpnadig(a)gmail.com>
Sent: Thu, 11 March, 2010 5:31:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] Wikimedia India Chapter
On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 5:06 PM, Shiju Alex <shijualexonline(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It will be good if all the other committee members introduce themselves to Indic language wiki community.
Most of the members have user pages on the respective Wikipedias and sister projects and their work speaks for themselves. I don't think there is a necessity for all committee members to separately introduce themselves here on this mailing list unless ofcourse they themselves like to.
I'm also quite surprised at the constant 'bold' or 'highlight' on words on emails exchanged this list.
Nevertheless, people who've not known me till now, can find more about me at:
More about me is here:
And I also happen to be the moderator of this list.
Hari Prasad Nadig
http://hpnadig.net | http://twitter.com/hpnadighttp://flickr.com/hpnadig
The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage.
The INTERNET now has a personality. YOURS! See your Yahoo! Homepage. http://in.yahoo.com/
I help the Wikimedia Foundation through it's advisory board, and just
wanted to say that I'm both grateful for your interest and glad that
Nadig, Sundar, and others have been able to clarify the situation. If
you look at meta, and particularly at the MoA, the process that has
unfolded over the last few years is clearly outlined, and the names of
Wikipedians associated with chapter efforts at different stages,
including currently, are clearly listed. Any suggestions you have for
Indian Wikipedians in general, and the chapter efforts in particular,
need to be taken seriously - and they will be.
Thank you for your message of clarification. As you agreed to some time
ago, could you please remove all the "Wikimedia India" references in
connection with yourself, on LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter, etc.? As you
have just explained, you are not involved in the set-up effort
currently. Therefore, removing references that connect you to the
ensuing Wikimedia India chapter would prevent the kind of
miscommunication that Praveen's message highlights. I appreciate your
urgent attention to this matter.
After incorporating feedback on meta, it ll be reviewed and approved by the chapters committee. Following that the registration procedure might take a month or more, I guess.
On Thu Mar 11th, 2010 8:19 AM IST CherianTinu Abraham wrote:
>Congratulations to all Indian Wikipedians on this milestone step.
>Btw when can we expect the chapter be officially constituted ?
>On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 9:08 AM, BalaSundaraRaman <sundarbecse(a)yahoo.com>wrote:
>> Please also spread the word in all Indian language wikis including the
>> English Wiki noticeboard.
>> - Sundar
>> "That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium
>> for the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
>> - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture
>> *From:* Hari Prasad Nadig <hpnadig(a)gmail.com>
>> *To:* Wikimedia India List <wikimediaindia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
>> *Sent:* Wed, March 10, 2010 8:22:42 AM
>> *Subject:* [Wikimediaindia-l] Wikimedia India Chapter
>> Dear all,
>> As Srikanth has already noticed in an earlier e-mail, the draft
>> Memoranda of Association for the proposed Wikimedia India Chapter has
>> been put up on Meta here:
>> Even as the team working on the current draft has spent the better
>> part of a year working on it, I am sure that there would be scope for
>> improvement. Please provide your invaluable comments and suggestions
>> on the relevant talk page:
>> However, given the time we have spent on the document, it is important
>> that we proceed quickly and hence, I suggest that the comments be made
>> on or before this Saturday, the 13th of March 2010. Let us maintain
>> the Wiki-etiquette expected out of us during the discussion.
>> People curious about the earlier and the current efforts at forming
>> the India chapter may find my blog post on it,
>> http://hpnadig.net/blog/2010/03/08/wikimedia-india/563 a complimenting
>> read. More on Wikimedia India chapter can be seen on
>> Let us look forward to a great response in discussing and debating the
>> MoA of the proposed Wikimedia India chapter.
>> Hari Prasad Nadig
>> http://hpnadig.net | http://twitter.com/hpnadig
>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list
>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list
As all of you are aware, the steward elections (
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Stewards/elections_2010) got over on
Februray. Many of you might have cast your votes during this elections. The
results are declared today.
I am extremely happy to inform all that, one of our colleague
*Jyothis*<http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Jyothis>(He is an active
Malayalam Wikipedian), has been elected as a steward (
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Stewards/elections_2010). He has received the
*second maximum percentage of votes* among all the candidates who contested
for the steward post.
*I assume that he is first Indian language wikipedian elected to that
For those who are not aware what is a steward is, the below definition from
MetaWiki will help.
Stewards are users with complete access to the wiki interface on all
Wikimedia wikis, including the ability to change any and all user rights and
groups. They are tasked with technical implementation of community
consensus, and dealing with emergencies (for example, cross-wiki vandalism).
Stewards aim to make no decisions as stewards, but are empowered to act as a
member of any permissions group on any project with no active member of that
permissions group. For example: wikis without administrators may call upon
stewards to fulfill that role; stewards will act as a bureaucrat as needed
on wikis without bureaucrats.
As mentioned in his
he can speak 5 languages (Malayalam
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malayalam>(his mother tongue),
Hindi <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindi>, and English) and read and write
3 languages (Malayalam, English, and Hindi).
As an Indian language wikian, he will be able to understand the technical
problems that we face in Indic langauge wikis. He can surely support most of
the Indian language Wikis.
I am extremely happy about the percentage of votes Jyothis recived, since
rest of the wikians started noticing contributions from non-latin language
I wish him all the success.