In a message dated 2/23/2008 10:03:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, Anthere9@yahoo.com writes:
Nod. I'll add that to the board+Sue discussion next week end, and see that this be addressed.
The truth is, I do not think anything will happen in Alexandria, though much depends on the controversy du jour, and the risks that the foundation is willing to take. I think the issue is more complex.
A few years ago, I worked on a film called Watermarks about an Austrian women's swim team in the 1930s. The top swimmer refused to participate in the 1936 Olympics because she did not want to show support for the German regime. She was, in response, stripped of her awards and removed from the record books (but had them restored a few years ago, shortly before she died). Rather, the question is whether the WMF is prepared to show implicit support for a regime that discriminates against homosexuals, members of religious minorities, bloggers, women, and political adversaries. For a movement motivated by "Free as in Freedom," it seems to be an ironic choice.
By the way, the same concerns were expressed two years ago by participants at the World Summit on the Information Society in Tunisia. I was there with a sizable group of Wikimedia people. And while the ubiquitous pictures of President Ben Ali were just creepy (the white suit didn't help much), it bothered me to see soldiers and policemen posted every couple of hundred meters along 60 kilometers of highway, or to see locals stopped in their cars for spot checks at the major intersections. Safety, no matter how efficient, comes at a price.
Just some thoughts,
Danny
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On 2/24/08, daniwo59@aol.com daniwo59@aol.com wrote: ...
the question is whether the WMF is prepared to show implicit support for a regime that discriminates against homosexuals, members of religious minorities, bloggers, women, and political adversaries. For a movement motivated by "Free as in Freedom," it seems to be an ironic choice.
It's showing express support for the Bibliotheca Alexandrina, the spiritual successor to the Library of Alexandria, and all that it represents.
-- Stephen Bain stephen.bain@gmail.com
On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 4:31 AM, daniwo59@aol.com wrote:
Rather, the question is whether the WMF is prepared to show implicit support for a regime that discriminates against homosexuals, members of religious minorities, bloggers, women, and political adversaries. For a movement motivated by "Free as in Freedom," it seems to be an ironic choice.
When Wikimania 2006 was held in Boston, WMF did not show implicit support (or implicit opposition) to Diebold voting computers, Gitmo, Waterboarding, tax cuts, NASCAR, wiretapping, US-VISIT, Dixie Chicks or "the neutrality of this book is disputed"-stickers on biology textbooks.
Mathias
On 24/02/2008, Mathias Schindler mathias.schindler@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 4:31 AM, daniwo59@aol.com wrote:
Rather, the question is whether the WMF is prepared to show implicit support for a regime that discriminates against homosexuals, members of religious minorities, bloggers, women, and political adversaries. For a movement motivated by "Free as in Freedom," it seems to be an ironic choice.
When Wikimania 2006 was held in Boston, WMF did not show implicit support (or implicit opposition) to Diebold voting computers, Gitmo, Waterboarding, tax cuts, NASCAR, wiretapping, US-VISIT, Dixie Chicks or "the neutrality of this book is disputed"-stickers on biology textbooks.
Danny's point that holding an event in a particular country shows implicit support (or rather, implicit acceptance) of the government, is quite different to supporting particular aspects of the country you're in. Every country has flaws and operating within the country doesn't give implicit support for each of those flaws. Those countries whose flaws are institution, law and government, are a different matter.
Example: holding a conference in a country which uses Diebold isn't express support for corruption; holding a conference in a country where homosexuality is illegal, and telling homosexual Wikimedians to 'not be obvious', is implicit acceptance of those laws and that regime.
On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 8:49 PM, Oldak Quill oldakquill@gmail.com wrote:
On 24/02/2008, Mathias Schindler mathias.schindler@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 4:31 AM, daniwo59@aol.com wrote:
Rather, the question is whether the WMF is prepared to show implicit support for a regime that discriminates against homosexuals, members of religious minorities, bloggers, women, and political adversaries. For a movement motivated by "Free as in Freedom," it seems to be an ironic choice.
When Wikimania 2006 was held in Boston, WMF did not show implicit support (or implicit opposition) to Diebold voting computers, Gitmo, Waterboarding, tax cuts, NASCAR, wiretapping, US-VISIT, Dixie Chicks or "the neutrality of this book is disputed"-stickers on biology textbooks.
Danny's point that holding an event in a particular country shows implicit support (or rather, implicit acceptance) of the government, is quite different to supporting particular aspects of the country you're in.
Mathias ist Deutsch.
On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 12:49 PM, Oldak Quill oldakquill@gmail.com wrote:
Example: holding a conference in a country which uses Diebold isn't express support for corruption; holding a conference in a country where homosexuality is illegal, and telling homosexual Wikimedians to 'not be obvious', is implicit acceptance of those laws and that regime.
I see. So, to follow up on Mathias' thoughts, we would implicitly accept waterboarding and support Guantanamo? Really, folks, this discussion is getting nowhere.
Michael
wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org