You may want to be sure and explain exactly what the
GFDL entails in this case. There is no guarantee that
any work that is done under this license will be
treated in a sacred manner by downstream users.
Non-speakers would be within full rights to take the
fork made in the Ute's language and put it up on a new
website or even on Wikipedia where any "16 year old
with a computer" will be able to edit it.
Wikipedia is alien to most cultures I imagine. It is
alien to capitalist culture and academic culture to
name two. However many people accostomed to those
cultures learn to adapt to and even appreciate WP
culture. I think you are focusing too much on the
negative at WP and overlooking the positives of
inter-culture collaboration. I hope your endeavor
succeeds in any event.
Birgitte SB
--- "Jeff V. Merkey" <jmerkey(a)wolfmountaingroup.com>
wrote:
Oldak Quill wrote:
Not at all. The best way to improve the site would
be to work with
other langauge Wikipedias and within Wikimedia.
Are
you being active
in seeking members?
Yes, I am, however, our culture is alien to the
Wikipedia culture and
there are going to be issues
with the way the site operates. So far every
Cherokee who has edited on
WP has gotten banned
or scrutinized to the point they leave. We have a
concept of respecting
the space of a person
who is working on something.
WP 's policies allow a 16 year old with a computer
to come in and
disrupt someone else's work and this
doesn;t work for us. Our culture is based on mutual
respect, and I
believe WP and Wales operate on the
premise people on WP should be the same way. This
has not been the
course followed. I think WP should
continue and we can do hat we need with the content
-- off site where
our cultural issues can coexist
peacefully.
You wont get many native people editing here due to
the way the site is
organized -- respect for others is
lacking in the way articles are edited. It's ok
though, we can still
both be successful if we figure out a way
to create dual environments where folks can be
successful.
I am meeting w9ith the tribal council of the Ute,
Shoshone, and Unita
Nations on July 18, at 1:30 in Fort Duschene
on the machine translations for their Wikipedia, so
I am making
excellent progress. They also expressed a desire
to host their content off Wikipedia due to their
review of the issues
with how the site works -- its alien to most native
cultures. The Ute's believe their language is
sacred and they don't
want non speakers working on it for religious
reasons. You are going to find this is a prevalent
attitude among
Native Peoples. The ute's did not even allow their
langauge to be written down until the mid 1970's due
to their religious
beliefs, so this is a big step for them.
Jeff
On 13/07/06, Jeff V. Merkey
<jmerkey(a)wolfmountaingroup.com> wrote:
>Robert Scott Horning wrote:
>
>
>
>>Jeffrey V. Merkey wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>Oldak Quill wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Most Wikimedia projects don't translate
"Wikipedia",
"Wiktionary", and
>>>>"Wikimedia", they
transliterate them. Even
non-Latin alphabets do
>>>>this: Russian Wikipedia is called
"ÐикипедиÑ" which transliterates as
>>>>Ve-I-Ka-I-Pe-Ye-De-I-Ya (those are
the names of
the letters, at
>>>>least). Does Cherokee have some
kind of formal
transliteration system?
>>>>
>>>>On 12/07/06, Jeffrey V. Merkey
<jmerkey(a)wolfmountaingroup.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The name should be:
>>>>>
>>>>>ááªáªáµ á¦á£áá³
>>>>>
>>>>>(digoweli gatsanula)
>>>>>"the books = pedia " " that are fast = wiki "
>>>>>
>>>>>to match the actual meanings of the words
"wiki" and
"pedia".
>>>>>
>>>>>The current name of the site, while catchy, is
not accurate for
the
>>>>>language, and was
synthesized.
>>>>>
>>>>>Just a suggestion...
>>>>>
>>>>>Jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>Yes. it does have one for words like this, but
taking potshots at the
>>>name can create something you do not
intend.
>>>
>>>Let's look at it:
>>>
>>>Wi-gi-que-di-ya
>>>
>>>wi - (negative imperfect past tense)
>>>gi - to combine
>>>que - incomplete verb root about an animal
>>>di - plural for a non living object
>>>ya - broad area of concern (means "pertains to
or covers a broad
area or
>>>topic)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>While it is interesting some of the points and
counter points about this
>>issue, isn't this something better
left to be
discussed on project pages
>>by participants and made as a local
decision? At
least I would feel
>>more comfortable with people who are
involved
with the development of
>>the project (aka Cherokee Wikipedia
content
developers) instead of
>>getting European or Austrialian attitudes
from
people who may never even
>>add a single word to that project.
>>
>>This whole discussion strikes me as something
very similar to when the
>>name Wikipedia itself was coined, along
with all
of the other major
>>sister projects and their names.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>There are no participants on the site. The site
has been dead for
>months. Probably because NONE OF THEM SPEAK
CHEROKEE.
>Perhaps best thing is to close the site
completely
and I'll just manage
>the fork off Wikipedia.
>
>Jeff
>
>Jeff
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