HI Galder,
My challenge is you trying to use the number of interactions in a month on
Twitter as a yardstick for Wikipedia's success on that platform and that's
a wrong premise to start from in all honesty.
And the fact that you use @euwikipedia as the baseline is even more
problematic for me. EUWikipedia has 7K plus followers compared to 600K plus
followers for Wikipedia.
The audience is vastly different. Wikipedia is an English based channel as
compared to Basque for @euwikipedia.
I don't see how they can even have a lookalike audience to make that
comparison.
Regards,
Justice.
On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 6:15 PM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi Justice,
I'm not trying to measure two accounts. I'm trying to know the number of
interactions in the last 28 days from @wikipedia, as Lauren claimed that
they are using that number when reporting. But it seems that getting that
number is now impossible.
It's the only thing I'm asking now, because Lauren claimed that the number
of interactions was the metric they are using to measure the success of the
strategy.
If someone at the Communications Team does know the number of interactions
in the last month, we could know if @wikipedia is succesful or not. We know
that @euwikipedia is succesful by THAT STANDARD, the one proposed by Lauren
to measure their work. Is not the one we use at @euwikipedia, as there are
other relevant factors, related to audiences and sociolinguistics. Is
@wikipedia who should support the claim they made two weeks ago, not me.
Thanks,
Galder
2022(e)ko abu. 2(a) 19:50 erabiltzaileak hau idatzi du (Justice
Okai-Allotey <owulakpakpo(a)gmail.com>)m>):
Hi Galder,
I have been reading the back and forth between you and Lauren, and I think
we are making a mistake by using two completely different pages audiences
to use as a reference.
I don't think the account you reference has the same audience as the
Wikipedia page, so it would be a mistake to use whatever metrics to make
assumptions or make absolute statements. As long as the audience is
different, there will be very different metrics, and the so-called industry
metrics are not the holy grail.
In other to make informed comments about any account metrics we first have
to know what kind of metrics they are collecting and what success looks
like regardless of each metric collected.
Vanity metrics like they say in this day and age is not all that social
media managers are looking for when they managing pages.
As a social media manager likes and engagement may not mean anything to me
but probably conversions will and this may not fully show in the metrics
because those may not be the channels we are using to measure conversions.
Industry standards are changing on a regular as far as managing social
media accounts are concerned.
Thank You.
Regards,
Justice.
On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 3:51 PM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Dear Lauren,
That's plainly false: the "industry standard" you are using to measure is
not related to Twitter engagement measure, because one uses impressions and
the other followers. So comparing one measure to the other is not
posssible, and we can't claim that we are above industry standards with the
data you are providing.
You can skip this conversation, you can report to whoever you want, but
you can't claim that the numbers are correct, because that is false.
Sincerely,
Galder
2022(e)ko abu. 2(a) 17:24 erabiltzaileak hau idatzi du (Lauren Dickinson <
ldickinson(a)wikimedia.org>)t;):
Hi Galder,
Respectfully, we use Twitter's definition of engagement rate
<https://help.twitter.com/en/managing-your-account/using-the-tweet-activity-dashboard>.
Over the last 28 day period, the Wikipedia account garnered a 3.0%
engagement rate. On Meta-Wiki
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Social_media#Re:_Twitter_engagement_questions>,
I previously shared several resources that confirm this is above industry
standards, as I thought you were asking as a point of interest. The
conversation, since, steered into an 'apples and oranges
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apples_and_oranges>' comparison of two
different accounts with different strategies, audiences, and goals.
Again, we will be discussing our social media strategy with members of the
Wikimedia communities on the Communications Committee in the near future.
For this discussion, I believe it has become circular and detracts from our
important work. I hope we can leave things at a place of respectful
agreement (or disagreement).
Lauren
*Lauren Dickinson (she/her)*
Senior Communications Manager
Wikimedia Foundation <https://wikimediafoundation.org/>
On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 4:32 AM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Hello again,
A couple of weeks ago this conversation was moved to Meta
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Social_media#Re:_Twitter_engagement_questions>.
There Lauren, from the Social Media team provided a couple of numbers to
show how @Wikipedia handle on Twitter is doing "above the industry
standards". The problem is that this numbers are plainly false. The team is
dividing the number of interactions by the number of impressions, instead
of the number of followers, that is what the metric was asking for.
I have asked there for the exact data on impressions, in order to
calculate the real impact, but once the team has seen that their numbers
are wrong, they are using distraction tactics in order to bury the problem.
So, as moving it to Meta seems like a move to forget about this, I would
like to discuss the topic again. Can someone in the WMF provide the number
of interactions we had in the last 28 days so we can see if, indeed, we are
"above the industry standards"?
Thanks
Galder
------------------------------
*From:* The Cunctator <cunctator(a)gmail.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, July 19, 2022 1:55 PM
*To:* Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
*Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: @Wikipedia losing opportunities in Twitter
I'm glad this conversation is moving over to meta-wiki. I hope the
communications staff will recognize their job should be to facilitate the
volunteers to do the work when it comes to anything other than speaking for
the Foundation.
On Mon, Jul 18, 2022, 2:22 PM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Lauren, I have followed there, because I think we are measuring two
very different things when talking about engagement.
Have a good day
Galder
2022(e)ko uzt. 18(a) 19:48 erabiltzaileak hau idatzi du (Lauren Dickinson <
ldickinson(a)wikimedia.org>)t;):
Hi Galder, I just left a more detailed reply on Meta-Wiki
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Social_media#Re:_Twitter_engagement_questions>
so we can continue the conversation there. In summary, we refer to a few
different sources to benchmark our engagement rates on @Wikipedia.
According to Rival IQ
<https://www.rivaliq.com/blog/social-media-industry-benchmark-report/>,
the median Twitter engagement rate for brands across all industries is
0.037%; for nonprofits specifically, it is 0.054%. According to Adobe
<https://www.adobe.com/express/learn/blog/what-is-a-good-social-media-engagement-rate>,
"most would consider 0.5% to be a good engagement rate for Twitter, with
anything above 1% great." @Wikipedia Twitter's engagement rate, according
to the dashboard
<https://help.twitter.com/en/managing-your-account/using-the-tweet-activity-dashboard>
we access when logged-in to the account, over the last 28 day period is
2.7%. In May and June, it was 2.6% and 2.2%, respectively. I hope the
resources shared are helpful for your management of @euwikipedia.
It's difficult to draw direct comparisons between the @euwikipedia and
@wikipedia accounts due to the difference in follower size and our more
global focus, as well as the objectives we are prioritizing to support the
movement but also build resonance among groups who can help us to push
forward our knowledge equity goals. At the same time, a straight
comparison—with the understanding that I cannot see the analytics for the
@euwikipedia account—reveals more retweets, likes, and comments on the
@Wikipedia account. I'd like to better understand however if we are
defining engagement differently. Also, an overall higher engagement rate
from Twitter's analytics could be a result of the low base effect
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_base_effect> (comparing two accounts
of different sizes).
Please note that I am managing a family commitment this week. I am happy
to continue this conversation on Meta-Wiki
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Social_media#Re:_Twitter_engagement_questions>
when I return.
Also, Andy, we will follow up this week regarding your questions
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum#Twitter> about the
@WiktionaryUsers and @Wiktionary accounts. We do not currently have access
but are exploring potential options via Twitter now.
Thank you, all, for your comments.
Lauren
*Lauren Dickinson (she/her)*
Senior Communications Manager
Wikimedia Foundation <https://wikimediafoundation.org/>
On Sun, Jul 17, 2022 at 5:16 AM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the answer, Lauren. I see quite a few interactions with the
tweets (despite having more than half a million followers). You say that
the engagement is above the industry standard. Is there any data we can use
to compare? I'm one of the managers of @euwikipedia and I see we have even
more engagement than @wikipedia, so I would like to know which are those
industry standards, so we can also measure ourselves.
Thanks
Galder
2022(e)ko uzt. 14(a) 00:56 erabiltzaileak hau idatzi du (Lauren Dickinson <
ldickinson(a)wikimedia.org>)t;):
Hi again — thanks for these comments!
I wanted to add that we very regularly refer to the ITN/DYK sections (and
OTD, too) when planning out the content calendar and responding to current
news and topics. These are great, natural sources of topic inspiration for
the Wikipedia channels.
As mentioned, we welcome other ideas for articles / topics to share. I
understand that the form may not always be the best way to do this. So, I
invite you to share ideas and feedback on Meta-Wiki
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Social_media> (we just did a light
clean up of the page). I am also a member of the Facebook group (Wikimedia
social media hub) that Andy shared; I see most posts, but the form and
Meta-Wiki are the best way to reach me.
For additional perspective, based on the note from Galder, there are
currently two staff, including myself working on digital communications
strategy at the Foundation, which includes both the Wikimedia and Wikipedia
social accounts, as well as our website and blogs. Across all, we
prioritize showing up with a consistent voice and identity, so through
association, people understand our work better.
Our strategy is global and we try hard to give equal weight to topics that
reflect the diversity of our world and movement—keeping track of movement
happenings, edit-a-thons, user group initiatives, current events, and
trends in places across the world. Rather than focusing on putting out a
large quantity of content, our goal with each post is to make people
understand the diverse work that the movement does and the diverse range of
knowledge that can be discovered on Wikipedia. This fosters understanding
with those who may not have deep knowledge of how the movement works and
what we stand for, but who may want to join us if they did.
In addition to our regular content, we must be constantly vigilant and
address potential misunderstandings about our work and projects. We monitor
social chatter closely and strive to ensure that our content and replies
meet the standards that uphold movement values. We track the metrics and
impact of our social media efforts and find that our strategy is working
well. For example, over the last year, we saw a 7% increase in Wikipedia's
Twitter following and a consistent above-average engagement rate when
compared to industry standards.
Lastly, I'll note that we are planning to discuss our refreshed digital
communications strategy with ComCom
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Communications_committee> in the coming
months. It includes lessons gleaned over the last two years on how to
position community work so that it reaches the right audiences and helps to
advance movement goals. One of our focuses is on better amplifying the work
of volunteers in the movement, and we are eager to get reactions / ideas on
ways we can do this even more.
I hope this is all helpful context and information. Thanks again for
sharing your ideas and feedback with us.
Lauren
*Lauren Dickinson (she/her)*
Senior Communications Manager
Wikimedia Foundation <https://wikimediafoundation.org/>
On Wed, Jul 13, 2022 at 4:24 PM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder158(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the answer, Lauren.
I have been looking at the stats of the last 4 weeks in Twitter, Facebook
and Instagram, to make an idea of the activity those accounts have. I don't
know how many people takes part in the process, but as I read "We" in the
answer, I'm going to assume that is more than one person to do all of this
job.
In Twitter, before my e-mail (after that there was a tweet by Wikimedia
Chile that was mentioned by @Wikipedia), the last tweet was two days
before. From June 10th to July 10th 34 tweets were done, 5 of them about
the concept "tea". That makes roughly one tweet a day, but there have been
many days without any tweet activity. In Facebook I count 24 posts related
to Wikipedia. This is 0,77 posts per day. In Instagram the situation is
worse, only 9 posts in one month, is to say, one every 3 days. It could be
that June 10th to July 10th is a bad moment, but I have looked up
previous months, and the trend is the same: most of the days is 1 tweet,
there are some days with 0 activity, and some other days with 3-4 tweets,
usually about the same topic.
I don't know how long it takes to do that, but based on my experience
managing social media, this activity (a tweet a day, 0,7 posts in Facebook
a day and 0,3 posts in Instagram, that actually are about the same topic)
takes around 30 minutes per day, a little bit longer if I need to take
extra-extra care to choose the article. I don't know how many workers are
in this process, but I assume that the "we" means than is more than one.
Let me help with this, because there are many processes that can booster
the activity and make our engagement in social media better. In the French
Wikipedia they have a page where people can propose tweets about curious
things (
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projet:Aide_et_accueil/Twitter/Tweets).
These tweets are shared with the hashtag #WPLSV
<https://twitter.com/hashtag/WPLSV>. Viquipedia
<https://twitter.com/Viquipedia/> is another success story, with a great
engagement (far better than the @Wikipedia account, by the way).
In the Basque Wikipedia account (
https://twitter.com/euwikipedia) we have
an internal shared spreadsheet where we put in the columns the days and in
the rows the scheduled time for the tweet. Every day (yes, we have only one
time zone, what makes things easier) we try to open with two "on this day".
This is extra easy, because you only need to look to the article about the
day and choose some that may be interesting or round numbers (100 years ago
today...). Then we try to tweet every day something about science, then
social sciences or history, a building, a fiction or artwork and we end the
day with a third "on this day" that may be more curious. We have two extra
time sections reserved for news about Wikipedia itself (statistics,
wikiprojects, featured content...) and something related to news of the
day/current events. We also tweet about sex whenever we have new content
every Friday at 23:59. This makes around 8 tweets a day, with some extra
options if we have something extra to tell, or there is an important recent
death, etc... Is true that we are not posting in Facebook or Instagram, but
this is a task we do when we have spare time in our regular jobs: we don't
have any extra worker to manage them. It takes around 4-5 hours to make a
full schedule for a month (and it would take less in English Wikipedia,
where there's plenty of content), and then around 8-10 hours to schedule
the ~250 tweets we make a month.
If you need help to manage the Twitter account, don't hesitate on
contacting other members of the community. We can help with this.
Sincerely,
Galder
------------------------------
*From:* Andy Mabbett <andy(a)pigsonthewing.org.uk>
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 13, 2022 8:37 PM
*To:* Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
*Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: @Wikipedia losing opportunities in Twitter
On Wed, 13 Jul 2022 at 01:23, Samuel Klein <meta.sj(a)gmail.com> wrote:
+1, not just en:wp. I'd love to see community mods involved in
maintaining the
core social accounts.
We have a Facebook group (not the ideal venue, but it works for those
of us on that site), "Wikimedia social media hub" [1], for that; but
WMF staff decided to cease their involvement about 18 months ago.
[1]
https://www.facebook.com/groups/wikisocialmediahub
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