I think it would. I see many people in the discussions, myself included,
who would not have any objections to a ban by ArbCom but who oppose the WMF
ban. Having a PhD in math and physics, I can not theoretically exclude that
there are active community members who are happy now and would object the
ArbCom ban, but, to be honest, I still would like to see one.
The amount of shit could indeed be approximately the same.
Cheers
Yaroslav
On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 11:31 PM GorillaWarfare <
gorillawarfarewikipedia(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Yaroslav,
I understand the difference. I'm simply raising an objection to the claim
that this would've gone over much better had it been the ArbCom and not the
WMF who placed a ban.
– Molly White (GorillaWarfare)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:GorillaWarfare
On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 5:01 PM Yaroslav Blanter <ymbalt(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Just to summarize the difference between WMF and
ArbCom, in view of the
majority of the en.wiki community:
We elect ArbCom, and if they do not do what they should be doing, they do
not get re-elected in two years, which happens on a regular basis
We do not elect WMF and in fact we have no means of influencing WMF
(apart
of the three Trustees we elect every three years
who are themselves
typically alienated from the community). Short of taking down the
fundraiser banner or of organizing a Wikipedia blackout.
This is the difference, and this is why virtually everybody who had to
say
smth about this episode was unhappy with the
process. Without looking at
the diffs, I only remember three users who were perfectly happy with what
happened, out of hundreds who said smth.
One unfortunate consequence of the whole episode was, whoever is right
and
whoever is wrong, the general opinion about WMF
in the community is
all-time low, with people generally not prepared to believe to anything
communicated to them. If WMF is not interested in getting very unpleasant
surprises, they should start working towards building the community
trust.
Cheers
Yaroslav
On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 10:48 PM GorillaWarfare <
gorillawarfarewikipedia(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 8:36 AM Fæ
<faewik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Any Arbcom approved sanction against Fram based on the evidence would
not
> > be controversial for anyone.
>
>
> Sorry for coming in late to this conversation; I've mostly been
following
the
sicussion happening on-wiki. But I wanted to pipe up to say that I
absolutely do not believe this is true (see also my comment here
<
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration_Commi…
).
To repeat my comment somewhat, the English
Wikipedia ArbCom has in the
past
> had to place similar bans: that is, ones against long-term contributors
> with many supporters, and ones in which the full details behind what
led
to
> the ban cannot be revealed publicly. The reaction has been quite
similar
to
the one the WMF is currently
experiencing—"star chamber" accusations,
claims that we've abused our power or the process, and assumptions that
the
ban is unwarranted unless everyone is allowed to
scrutinize the private
evidence. The ArbCom is empowered to take action based off of
privately-submitted evidence and private discussion, but in practice it
is
extremely poorly-received when we do, basically
across-the-board.
– Molly (GorillaWarfare)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:GorillaWarfare
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: Wikimedia-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>