I do not "describe how - in your opinion - the conduct of the English Wikipedia and the Wikimedia Foundation don't live up to those principles".
I'm actually simply pointing-out that the *stated* semi-transparency, and hierarchical structure, of Wikipedia/Wikimedia is contrary to the *stated* principles of transparency and no hierarchy.
Nowhere in this thread have I stated that this is a good or bad thing in relation to Wikipedia/Wikimedia.
James
On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 8:37 PM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
I don't see the conflict James Riggs is describing. You point to statements of principles by Jimmy Wales, and then describe how - in your opinion - the conduct of the English Wikipedia and the Wikimedia Foundation don't live up to those principles. Well, that doesn't shock me and it shouldn't shock you.
The English Wikipedia is quite transparent, more so than perhaps any community or organizational structure I've encountered. Only mailing lists that regularly deal with personal, private information are closed to the community. Nearly all decision making of any weight is done on-wiki, with complete access for anyone who wants it to all or mostly all discussion precursors.
The Wikimedia Foundation is a business, and by the standards of modern business it is also quite transparent. Its financial information, its plans, its employee roster, its job descriptions, its revenue and fund raising model and its long term goals are all available for your discovery. Every major decision that impacts the projects is discussed publicly ahead of time. That *is* transparency, in my opinion.
When someone who self describes as a "newbie" that has not joined in working on the Wikimedia projects posts to the Foundation mailing list describing what he believes to be a material mischaracterisation, he gets a response from the founder and the deputy director (and former board member) in short order. Try doing that with General Electric, or really nearly any other corporation in the world.
Your e-mails indicate that you concluded first and asked second, so hopefully you will now reconsider.
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