On 29/03/2008, Andrew Leung <andrewcleung@hotmail.com> wrote:

I'm not too sure. We originally ran for 2008, then withdraw to improve the bid so that we will have a shot at 2009. Now that 2009 is down, I (for one) ran out of patience. Nicholas (Zanimum) happily accepted that fact, and Nat looks like he's standing neutral right now.

Time for some rant since this is not in Wikipedia. They blame us for having repeated information. BUT the university doesn't move its location, nor its building will be torn down. And take a look at Buenos Aires' bid. Some of the images just bluffs. (See http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikimania_2009_Buenos_Aires_-_Planning_-_Overview.png and http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/meta/6/61/Wikimania_2009_Buenos_Aires_-_Planning_-_Detailed.png) Looks impressive, doesn't it? They don't have to follow this timeline at all. They are just showing it to impressive the judges. Of the 44 lines in that excel screenshot, 1 (YES, 1!) line is dedicated to the actual event (you have to maximize the image, scroll down to row ID 43 in the detailed version of image).

And look at the sponsorship section in Buenos Aires' bid. It says "We are in talks with important firms of both the international and local level, but of course more will come if Buenos Aires is chosen." Will Toronto's bid looks better if we replace Buenos Aires with Toronto in the previous sentence? Yes. And Buenos Aires, thanks for being captain obvious. Of course more sponsorships will come if the city is chosen. </rant>

I thought this is an international event but some of the jury team is a bit lame, believing in statements that are stating the obvious.

Andrew

Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2008 15:25:24 -0700
From: geo.plrd@yahoo.com
To: wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*

Well then, lets fix the bid and resubmit.

----- Original Message ----
From: Alan Walker <fastalan@gmail.com>
To: Wikimedia Canada planning list <wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 2:50:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*

I think it is presumptuous to assume there is any punishment rendered for attempting to win a bid. In respect to the jury comment, it seems they are stating there was a lack of clarity on the firmness of the offer of facilities for the University of Toronto.

On 29/03/2008, Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd@yahoo.com> wrote:

Thats too bad. Move the bid site to another city? Also you could probably have the results invalidated next year if they are punishing cities for running.

----- Original Message ----
From: Andrew Leung <andrewcleung@hotmail.com>
To: Wikimedia Canada planning list <wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 7:11:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*

I'm perplexed by this statement from the jury...

"However, the jury felt that Buenos Aires' bid showed stronger organization overall. Additionally, much of the information in the Toronto bid was carried over from previous bids, and it was unclear how much of a commitment for the University of Toronto facilities there was specifically for 2009."

While I agree most info are the same between the 2008 and 2009 bid, we did add a lot more information. It sounds like they're trying to compare whether our bid improved between 2008 and 2009. And it sounds like they're punishing us for running in the bid twice in a row. Next year it will be even more unlikely that we'll win the bid even if we did significant improvement because Australia hasn't has a chance to host it.

Andrew

Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 18:08:19 -0700
From: geo.plrd@yahoo.com
To: wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*

Well then lets fix the problems.

----- Original Message ----
From: Casey Brown <cbrown1023.ml@gmail.com>
To: Wikimedia Canada planning list <wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org>
Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 5:34:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*

If you'll read the e-mail by Phoebe that Nick forwarded, you'll see
exactly why BA won and some information on why CA didn't. :-)

On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 8:20 PM, Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> run for 2010 and find out why BA won.
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Andrew Leung <andrewcleung@hotmail.com>
> To: Wikimedia Canada planning list <wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org>
> Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 1:05:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania
> *2009*
>
>
> So are we going to run for 2010's? Or just call it quit?
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> > Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 13:55:43 -0500
> > From: nicholasmoreau@gmail.com
> > To: wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Subject: [Wikimedia-Canada] Fwd: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania
> *2009*
> >
> > So everybody is aware...
> >
> > Nick
> >
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > From: phoebe ayers <phoebe.wiki@gmail.com>
> > Date: Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 9:21 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Announcement: Wikimania *2009*
> > To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
> > <foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org>, "Wikimania general list (open
> > subscription)" <wikimania-l@lists.wikimedia.org>
> >
> >
> > I was so excited about sending the announcement that I forgot to
> > proofread the subject line! Oh well. Both *2008* AND *2009* should be
> > exciting conferences :)
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 8:44 AM, phoebe ayers <phoebe.wiki@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > All,
> > >
> > > We are pleased to announce that Buenos Aires has been selected as the
> > > location for Wikimania 2009.
> > >
> > > The jury was particularly excited by a few parts of the Buenos Aires
> bid:
> > > * A strong, organized team, with division of labor already underway
> > > and support from Wikimedia Argentina. Many people contributed to the
> > > bid, with obvious enthusiasm for organizing the conference and quick
> > > responses to inquiries.
> > > * A detailed budget proposal and planning schedule. Many major
> > > expenses are being covered by the provider. The total budget is
> > > similar to Wikimania 2007's, including a larger travel scholarship
> > > fund, and they have provided detailed charts ahead of time.
> > > * A significant number of sponsors already lined up, with some already
> > > confirmed. They hope to cover half the accommodation and $60k in
> > > travel scholarships, which will help to ease travel costs for
> > > participants from far away.
> > > * A solid venue : as with Toronto, this was situated within a
> > > well-maintained cultural center in a major international city, near an
> > > airline hub; culturally open, and an international melting pot.
> > > * Relaxed visa rules, and easy entry from South American countries.
> > > * Good Spanish-language media contacts, with the promise of outreach
> > > to and the opportunity to work with the Spanish-language Wikimedia
> > > communities.
> > >
> > > Toronto, the runner up, also provided a great bid. The jury was
> > > especially excited by:
> > > * Strong English-language press in the area, and media experience
> > > among the bid team
> > > * A very accessible venue, especially for US/European attendees.
> > > * An excellent venue : a university campus, with dorms directly at the
> > > venue. As with Buenos Aires, it was situated within a well-maintained
> > > cultural center in a major international city, near an airline hub;
> > > culturally open, and an international melting pot.
> > > * Extensive budget accommodation in the dorms; with many options for
> > > casual social space.
> > > * A dedicated bid team, with the hope of Wikimedia Canada being formed
> > > in time to help coordinate.
> > >
> > > However, the jury felt that Buenos Aires' bid showed stronger
> > > organization overall. Additionally, much of the information in the
> > > Toronto bid was carried over from previous bids, and it was unclear
> > > how much of a commitment for the University of Toronto facilities
> > > there was specifically for 2009.
> > >
> > > Brisbane and Karlsruhe also provided good bids. Brisbane in particular
> > > had an enthusiastic bid team and a strong proposal, with particularly
> > > good local sponsorship opportunities; though this was offset by the
> > > high travel costs for out-of-country attendees. The jury felt both
> > > bids needed more detail (including specifics about accommodation
> > > options, and more detailed budget information) to be compelling.
> > >
> > > As in previous years, the relative accessibility of locations was
> > > extensively discussed. The jury believes that it's important for
> > > Wikimania to be accessible to as wide an audience as possible,
> > > particularly to members of the Wikimedia community; the relatively
> > > high cost of travel to South America from Europe and North America was
> > > one of the most significant drawbacks we identified in the Buenos
> > > Aires bid—especially coming on the heels of Taipei and Alexandria.
> > > Having said that, the jury believes that the Buenos Aires bid overcame
> > > this drawback with its numerous advantages, among those the
> > > opportunity to hold the conference in a Spanish-speaking locale, on a
> > > new continent. We hope to receive strong bids from easily accessible
> > > locations for 2010.
> > >
> > > Congratulations to the Buenos Aires team! Wikimania 2009 promises to
> > > be an exciting and successful conference.
> > >
> > > -- Phoebe Ayers, Cary Bass, James Forrester (non-voting jury
> > > moderators), on behalf of the Wikimania 2009 Jury
> > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2009/Jury
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-ca mailing list
> > Wikimedia-ca@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-ca
>
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--
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Cbrown1023

---
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