No. We figured that uploading to YouTube is the only way we can get all the videos out before Wikimania 2014. (Longer, more technical answer follows) We performed a series of pilot tests in December and early January and found two main technical problems with uploading the videos from Hong Kong to Commons. The first one is bandwidth. We have about 1TB of video footage. Because Hong Kong is on the opposite side of the planet from the WMF datacenters, we can only eke out an average speed of 50kB/s even on a "fast" connection in Hong Kong. At that rate it'll take 250 computer-days (plus extra time cost due to errors etc) of non-stop uploading to get it done. We don't have that many dedicated volunteers who are willing to donate that much machine time. In contrast, we can get an average speed of 500kB/s uploading to YouTube because they have a local node in Hong Kong. Enoch Tam (aka. "ET", many of you will remember him for all the errands he ran at Wikimania) and myself are donating all our machine idle time to the task, so we're confident it'll be done in less than a month. The second challenge is rendering. YouTube isn't just a video CDN; it is a combined rendering and distribution service. The footage we got from SocRec is in unedited 2-4GB chunks of M2T and MTS files, which Commons cannot handle. Uploading to Commons would require the use of rendering software (and a lot of computing) to convert and edit them to OGV. This requires a further amount of volunteer dedication, video-editing software, and computing power which we don't have. The strategy at the moment is that we upload the raw footage to YouTube, then edit them into sessions using YouTube's browser video editor. To see the details and progress of what we're doing, see https://wikimania2013.wikimedia.org/wiki/Video_upload . We did contemplate, at one point about two weeks ago, that we shouldn't even attempt to upload the videos from Hong Kong, and just mail the 2TB external HDD with the raw footage to WMF or WMUK. Now that Andrew pointed out that downloading and keeping a copy of YouTube videos violates their TOS regardless of licence, I guess we could've just given up back then. I guess the best course of action now is that we continue uploading and editing the videos on YouTube. If someone at WMF or WMUK is willing to render and edit the videos again from scratch, we'll send them the HDD after we're done here. Deryck On 20 Jan 2014 23:19, "Andrew Lih" <andrew(a)andrewlih.com> wrote: > Any plans to upload them to Commons or Internet Archive, or is > this something we can get volunteers to help with? > > The only reason is that in general, downloading and keeping videos from > YouTube violates their terms of service. Even if they are CC licensed. > > Thanks. > -Andrew > > > -Andrew Lih > Associate professor of journalism, American University > Email: andrew(a)andrewlih.com > WEB: http://www.andrewlih.com > BOOK: The Wikipedia Revolution: http://www.wikipediarevolution.com > PROJECT: Wiki Makes Video > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wiki_Makes_Video > > > On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 11:59 AM, Deryck Chan <deryckchan(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote: > >> Good evening Wikimaniacs! >> >> We now have a distributed effort by multiple volunteers in Hong Kong to >> upload all the video footage from Wikimania 2013 onto YouTube. If you gave >> a presentation or workshop at Wikimania (and haven't requested that we >> don't video you), keep an eye on WMHK's YouTube channel: >> http://www.youtube.com/user/WikimediaHK >> >> The plan is that all videos will be available by the end of February. >> >> We'd be grateful if you can watch your video and see if there are any >> defects, because we can't watch every second of the uploaded videos to >> check them! >> >> Deryck >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimania-l mailing list >> Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimania-l mailing list > Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l > >

Andrew Lih, 21/01/2014 06:05: Thanks for the extensive explanation, and as someone who's helped with I've uploaded thousands of YouTube videos to archive.org, I can do these too with no problem. Nemo _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

intended through the provided functionality of the Service and as permitted under these Terms of Service. *You shall not download any Content unless you see a “download” or similar link displayed by YouTube on the Service for that Content.* You shall not copy, reproduce, make available online or electronically transmit, publish, adapt, distribute, transmit, broadcast, display, sell, license, or otherwise exploit any Content for any other purposes *without the prior written consent of YouTube or the respective licensors of the Content*. YouTube and its licensors reserve all rights not expressly granted in and to the Service and the Content.

I already started uploading around 15 of them, not reading the ToS beforehand. :/ I used the script youtube2mediawiki.py so I am not sure I technically have 'downloaded' the files, at least they have never been on my computer. /Jan 21 januari 2014, Andrew Lih <andrew(a)andrewlih.com> skrev: Oh I can do it, and I know how to do so technically. I'm just pointing out by the letter of YouTube's TOS it's not permitted. :) -Andrew Lih Associate professor of journalism, American University Email: andrew(a)andrewlih.com WEB: http://www.andrewlih.com BOOK: The Wikipedia Revolution: http://www.wikipediarevolution.com PROJECT: Wiki Makes Video http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wiki_Makes_Video On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 9:33 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemowiki(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote: Andrew Lih, 21/01/2014 06:05: Thanks for the extensive explanation, and as someone who's helped with Wikimania video in the past, I absolutely feel your pain and commend you for doing what you have so far. Downloading from YouTube violates their TOS, though you'll notice people do it all the time. I've uploaded thousands of YouTube videos to archive.org, I can do these too with no problem. Nemo _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

I've just scrutinised the YouTube TOS in detail for the first time. The clause which says you can't download videos is in 5(B): (my emphasis) You may access Content for your information and personal use solely as We obviously have the prior written consent to reproduce the videos to Commons. From my reading of the TOS, copying the videos to Commons shouldn't violate the TOS (in part because it wasn't "downloaded" - though "download" wasn't explicitly defined in the TOS). IANAL. On 21 January 2014 23:50, Jan Ainali <jan(a)ainali.com> wrote: _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

On 22 January 2014 01:49, Andrew Lih <andrew(a)andrewlih.com> wrote: Jan pointed out that youtube2mediawiki.py doesn't actually "download" the video, so I think we're fine with the provisions of licensor's permission in the sentence below.

Commons is ultra-conservative with copyright, but doesn't really care about any other terms and conditions imposed by anyone else. So I think it's fine to transfer the videos from YouTube to Commons - no copyright is violated and the ambiguity in the YouTube TOS works in our favour.

Actually, there's a "Download MP4" button when I'm logged in as Wikimedia Hong Kong (channel owner). So if you want to transfer the videos, email me off-list and I'll add you to the admin list of the WMHK YouTube channel. Then everybody including the YouTube TOS will be happy. On 22 Jan 2014 19:58, "Andrew Lih" <andrew(a)andrewlih.com> wrote: _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

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Dear Deryck, Thanks for your great job! For the closing ceremony, do you think you can recover from Livestream? Best regards, Alan Lai Sent on the road ---- Deryck Chan wrote ---- Hello Wikimaniacs again! We've uploaded and released all the available Wikimania 2013 videos onto WMHK's YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/wikimediahk The submission pages now have links to the videos on YouTube. The videos can also be searched on YouTube by name of lead author or title of presentation; some titles have been modified to fit the title length limit. A few sessions' footage (including the closing ceremony, unfortunately) are corrupt and couldn't be recovered. In a few other sessions, somebody accidentally turned off or forgot to turn on the camera, so only part of the session was recorded; these incomplete videos were uploaded anyway. Next step: We have two 2TB HDDs, each containing a complete copy of the footage (one of them also has the corrupted footage fragments). We are happy to mail them to someone at WMF or a European / North American chapter so they can process the footage, re-render it (and improve the audio quality!), and upload them to Commons. Deryck PS. Thanks Enoch Tam and Walter Wan who contributed to the uploading work! On 21 January 2014 13:05, Andrew Lih <andrew(a)andrewlih.com> wrote: _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

Deryck Chan, 18/01/2014 17:59: We now have a distributed effort by multiple volunteers in Hong Kong to Thanks for coordinating and to all the volunteers involved, an amusing effort! I saw that you used the YouTube video editor and there are videos in HD too (1280x720px): Hong Kong beats Washington, arriving first despite a slower start. ;-) Please add your learnings to the Wikimania Handbook. I noticed two things: * WebM format is available at varying qualities, I suppose they're still being derived but I'm not sure.

too. Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciaK855R66g

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And now all the 71 1280x720px videos are on <https://archive.org/search. php?query=subject%3A%22Wikimania+2013%22> too. In a couple hours at most they should all have ogv. Nemo _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

And now all the 71 1280x720px videos are on <https://archive.org/search.php?query=subject%3A%22Wikimania+2013%22> too. In a couple hours at most they should all have ogv.

Thanks for sharing. I didn't know of the category. Only 21 videos so far?

rexford | google.com/+nkansahrexford | sent from tab On Mar 25, 2014 8:07 PM, "Matthew Flaschen" &lt;mflaschen(a)wikimedia.org&gt; wrote: _______________________________________________ Wikimania-l mailing list Wikimania-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimania-l

Thanks for sharing. I didn't know of the category. Only 21 videos so far?