My own grain of salt as well

A few months ago, Wikimedia France was looking for an african wikipedian to facilitate an edit-a-thon in Africa as part of one of WM FR projects. Wikimedia France was supporting his travelling costs to the edit-a-thon place. A volunteer showed up, willing to do it. He lived in a nearby country.

When it came to reimburse his travel costs, Wikimedia France asked him to become a member of Wikimedia France to do so. The wikipedian was perplex about this request and asked me what I thought. I was perplex about this request as well and asked explanation. I got it and it really made sense to me.

The main argument is insurance. If an association "pays" (hire) a consultant/freelancer to facilitate an edit-a-thon, the person - as a professional - normally is covered by his own professionnal insurance. So if anything happens during the edit-a-thon, his insurance will cover this. But if the person providing the training is a volunteer, it is VERY likely that he has no insurance to cover anything that might happen. A personal insurance would probably not cover the situation. Only a professional insurance could. If the trainer is not covered and something happen, since the event is organized by Wikimedia France, the "victim" would turn toward Wikimedia France.

Of course Wikimedia France has an insurance but the insurance needs to be bordered. It can not cover anything, anyone, in all situations. And one of the easiest border is... membership. A contract can be drawn that covers members whilst they are participating to an event organized by Wikimedia France. A contract that would cover what could happen to anyone showing up at an event organized by Wikimedia France is a different story.

So the best way recommanded by interested parties and councillors is that any person reimbursed for an action done as part of Wikimedia France activities should be a member of the association. As such, he is covered by Wikimedia France insurance.

Risker statement "The Wikimedia movement has openly embraced the lack of requirement to identify or create an account/membership to participate since day one of
its existence." is actually... not correct. A lot of the activity of the Wikimedia mouvement go through participation to a User Group or a Wikimedia Chapter or various Thematic Organisations. And identification and joining as member are actually required in those cases. 
Also... identification is also required to join various online "tasks forces" such as steward or OTRS agent.

Flo


Le 18/03/16 09:48, Gabriel Thullen a écrit :
I will add my grain of salt to this discussion.
When I was young, and I was traveling a lot, I would stay in Youth Hostels. Membership was mandatory.
Things have changed a bit, Youth Hostels now call themselves "Hostelling International" and in most places membership is no longer mandatory. But members (of any national organization) get all sorts of discounts and other perks.

I do not understand what the problem is if a membership is required in order to attend Wikimania. Does anybody have a Real Life example where such a membership has posed a problem ? Or are we just kibitzing to pass the time until June ?

Gabe

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 2:43 AM, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,

2016-03-17 23:55 GMT+01:00 Risker <risker.wp@gmail.com>:
> Nemo, it's not standard practice. I've been to four or five wikimanias and
> never had to join an association to go there. I have never had to join an
> association to attend any other Wikimedia-related conference, session, or
> activity. The Wikimedia movement has openly embraced the lack of requirement
> to identify or create an account/membership to participate since day one of
> its existence.  The budget of Wikimania should be published onwiki, it
> should be transparent (to use the current buzzword) to everyone, and nobody
> should have to pay money in order to find out its budget.

Before we get dragged too much into the philosophical question of what
being Truly Wikimedian (TM) really means I would like to point out a
little more of the context, with the disclaimer that: (1) I am not a
lawyer and (2) I am not/was not part of the group that made the
specific decision of setting up the association (3) I hope that
Iolanda and the team can find a solution to accommodate any specific
need.

Here some context:

(a) When you arrive in Italy if you stay for more than 48 hours, the
person/organization hosting you (regardless of your citizenship, this
applies to Italian citizens as well if they are staying in some place
that is not their habitual residence) must communicate within 8 days
your presence and your data to the local Questura (basically, the
government branch managing the police force). This is why in all
hotels, hostels, B&Bs and even in places such as AirBnB apartments you
are usually asked to provide data such as your passport number. This
is to say that the idea of lack of identification is understandable in
general and easy to apply on the internet, but it is less so when you
are staying somewhere.

(b) Setting up a company is more costly and complex than setting up an
association, moreover there is no equivalent in Italy of the concept
of "Public-benefit corporations". Setting up a Foundation is expensive
as well. Futhermore, setting up a company excludes (as per the law)
the possibility of accessing some facilitations that are provided to
non-profit associations. Not secondarily, if you are a company
basically it is assumed that all of your activities are meant to
generate a profit even if you actually do not make one. So, you are
basically required to pay taxes even if as a non-profit you can get an
exemption.

(c) Related to (b) the Italian law makes a distinction between events
that are (mainly? I am not sure) organized for the members of an
associations and events that are (mainly) organized for the general
public. In the former case the regulations are easier to fulfill.

As I said, I am sure that Iolanda and the team will look further into
the matter and try to solve any issue that you may have. The general
setting for which an association is needed, however, is the one
presented above.

Ciao,

C

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