Am 22.07.2011 12:01, schrieb Lodewijk:
Hi Hubert,
thanks for summarizing your ideas. The actual situation will be a little
different most likely. I had a short chat with Maarten yesterday, and it
seems like the upload form progress is going well. Don't pin me down on
details, but this should give an idea.�
1. We will indeed be able to use the new upload wizard
hi Lodewijk,
We do not care which upload-Form we will use, important for us is the
possibility to handover predefined informations.
2. There will be a 'campaign' for each
country. For example the campaign
'wlm-ch'
The same in Austria, but this will be part of my next efforts,
what
possibilities we have, especially if and how we are able to place
category-related banner inside Wikipedia.
3. Each campaign will be translated into several
languages (always make
English available for tourists!), for example uselang=en
4. It will not be possible to call a database during the upload process.�
I know
it. Therefor our solution, using informations directly from the
Tables.
5. The user will provide the identifier of the
object in the form
This is exactly, what we will avoid. What happens, if the User
have no
idea, where he will get the ID? This is, in my opinion, the first weak
point in the system.
Last year we did this too, and it worked quite well. We had several methods
explained how they could find the identifier - through Wikipedia's lists,
through a map with all the monuments on it (using the coordinates) or in
another way. I believe someone was working on making it possible to query
the database too etc. Maarten (or someone else) might be able to give more
details. We can provide a link to that within the form. If we can transfer
the identifier with the url, we could prefill it. But that assumes they
already look it up on beforehand.
6. Information
like categories, object names etc can be added later with
a bot, based on this identifier.
Unless we have to do with computer-affinity
users, this will be no
problem, because the latter will find the user ID. But what happens to
those, the computer (and Wikipedia) is not more than a simple tool and
not familiar with Alt-tab or Ctrl-tab having problems with several
browser-tabs at the same time? Seniors? Pupils?
OK, I was not clear here I guess. Some volunteers will add this information
with a bot for /all/ uploads, based on the database (which is again based on
the wikipedia lists). If you are a pupil, then don't worry - just upload and
we will take care of the rest.
My own experience with Commons was, that I tried three times, unless I
uploaded my first picture successfully. But I am Wikipedian since 2004
with 80.000 edits!
7. Whether prefilling based on the url is
possible or not is to be found
out.�
Yes. We demonstrated one single possibility, which is - of course -
optimized for austrian monument lists.
I know this is not perfect, but this seems to be
the best we can
realistically aim for right now. What would be very very helpful by the
way is if someone could hack a special Commonist together. Removing all
the unnecessary fields, tweaking it for WLM and make mass uploading that
way easier.�
jepp.
Hubertl.
Lodewijk
2011/7/22 Hubert <hubert.laska(a)gmx.at <mailto:hubert.laska@gmx.at>>
We can summarize the yesterday discussion and
Upload-form-demonstration,
I think we all agree so far:
An enormously important point for the entire project WLM is the
ability
to simplify the uploading process for the
participants of the photo
contest. Basically, this is quiet easy to create, but we must
emphasize
the following:
1. Before any participation is the registration - the actual
situation
is not reduceable.
indeed
�
2. To the participants it must be given some specific requirements
without choice: That is: "Own work" as well as the predefined
license.
yup
�
3. Thus there remains only that the participants upload his image and
the ability, to give a personal description (if desired).
Upload the image and give identifier (either prefilled or not)
�
That's all from the perspective of the participant. Our perspective
results in further, much more important considerations:
1. We need to identify the images - The easiest way is a country code
and the object ID as a minimal setting.
Country code: campaign (which form do you use)
ID: identifier field
�
2. To reduce further work from our side, the images should be
categorized at the same time while the upload-process takes place,
but
this requires a good category management,
which at least will assume
the
category-system from Wikipedia to Commons.
This will have to happen with a bot.�
�
3. In addition, we should automatically hand over as much information
as
possible (or necessary). This is: name of the
object, address of the
object (district, town name, adress), geographic coordinates, perhaps
also an existing short description of inside the monument-tables. But
that presupposes the access to the upload-form directly from
Wikipedia
(cultural monument tables).
This will have to happen after uploading with a bot.�
�
4. Images of cultural objects, which are not officially designated
cultural monuments (and therefore not included in the lists) can be
uploaded via the parish or other articles, thus we need an
Community-Code �as the ID key, zip code, an the country code as a
minimum requirement.
If the monument is not in the list, they can not participate in the
contest unfortunately. At least, that is the very basis of the contest,
if an exception to that is necessary, lets discuss that in a seperate
thread.�
�
5. We need to clarify that only images can participate in this
contest,
which are uploaded in September. This can be
regulated, so that any
upload from the relevant pages with the special upload form is only
possible, when this forms are unlocked on september, 1. Only with the
upload form the object ID can be transfered.
A bot can easily change templates of all uploads with the WLM template
which are uploaded before Sept 1. No need to worry about that.�
�
6. We need to ensure in Commons itself, that any uploading for the
competition must be easily visible through a special selection of
different forms. This requires a clear indication (banners etc)
All this concerns only one aspect of the complete project, but it is
neccessary for the persistent use of the images via Commons, as well
as
for the assessment by the national judging
panels.
That implementation is possible to handover all the information with
an
link, I demonstrated yesterday. Our task
should be to explore the
already existing links to the individual objects within Wikipedia and
to
integrate into the overall concept.
Technically that is possible yes, however it is unsure if this would
also be possible in a simplified form. The form you used is
unfortunately incomprehensible for most mortals. I usually suggest that
my grandmother should be able to participate.�
�
greetings from Vienna
Hubertl
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