WikiEN-l July 2005

wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org

156 participants
216 discussions

Re: Meta e-mail
by steve v 28 Jul '05

28 Jul '05

Here's what prompted the fwd (last) email: --- Irate wrote: > You haven't reanabled my WikiMeid a account after > Anthere corrupt Blocking, and most of you haven't > replied. That seems a tad uncooperative to me. I > suggest you block yourself so as not to be > inconsistent. > > If I am blocked Zannerium should defintely be > blocked. He ignored my request for many times longer > than I ignored him. I even had to go looking for an > admin to try and get him to stopped editing my > comments on my talk page, without signing them. > > I now thanks to the activities of one of your admins > am blocked. The explnation lack of cooperatine is > false, as people have cooperted with me far less. > Like people who have received this email but refuse > to answer or do anything are you and more or less > guilty of being uncooperative. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: Is "fetus" = "human life" POV?
by Daniel P. B. Smith 28 Jul '05

28 Jul '05

> From: steve v <vertigosteve(a)yahoo.com> > > Question: Is it POV to say that a fetus is a "human > life," and by terminology, thus entitled to universal > "human rights" and societal "personhood" status? I think there certainly is a point of view involved here, in the sense that there is a continuous spectrum of things ranging from things that few would consider to be "human life" and things that most would consider to be "human life," and anywhere you draw the line represents some kind of point of view. I'm going to list some points in that spectrum. I ask you, _not_ where you draw the line, but whether it is _possible_ to draw that line anywhere without expressing a point of view. 1) Since a mouse shares about 90% of its genome with humans, wouldn't a Martian consider that for all intents and purposes a mouse is practically "human" life? 2) At this point, it has been established that rats dream. Over the past couple of decades, ethologists have increasingly adopted the, well, point of view that the concept of "consciousness" has scientific validity... and that mammals in fact are conscious. Probably most people, scientists or not, would agree that mammals are capable of feeling physical pain, and that many of them are capable of feeling emotions such as grief or joy. By virtue of sharing the mental characteristics that constitute human personhood, are they essentially "human" life and entitled to "personhood?" 3) Are the red blood cells in the last blood donation I made, alive? (They metabolize and do many things but cannot reproduce). If they are alive, they are certainly human. Are they "human life?" 4) How about cells scraped from the inside of my cheeks, which are a classic high-school material for studying chromosomes? 5) How about my white blood cells, which have nuclei and contain my genome and can reproduce themselves, but cannot with present technology reproduce another human being? 6) How about a human kidney, removed from a car accident victim who is carrying an organ donor card? That is, there is no reasonable doubt that the person involved is "dead," yet the kidney is "still alive," and is certainly "human?" 7) How about my sperm cells, which are certainly alive and certainly human and can reproduce another human being when combined with genetic material from an ovum, but cannot with present technology reproduce another human being _by themselves?_ 8) How about a sperm and an ovum, considered together, during the time period when the sperm has entered the ovum fertilization membrane has lifted, so that it is all but certain that a) no other sperm can fertilize that ovum and b) that particular sperm will in fact fertilize the ovum... but the nuclei have not yet merged? At this point in time, the probability that a human being will develop is almost the same as it is just after fertilization, and in both cases we know exactly "who" it will be (in the sense of knowing the genetic complement). 9) You use the word "fetus," so I assume you accept the ordinary distinction between a "fetus" and "embryo" (less than 8 weeks old). IS an embryo human life? Just like the separate egg-and-sperm just prior to fertilization, the embryo is pretty much predestined to _become_ human life, but it doesn't look like a human being and it doesn't look different from a nonhuman embryo. Is it "human life?" 10) first-trimeter fetuses 11) second-trimester fetuses 12) third-trimester fetuses 13) Newborn infants 14) Toddlers -- Jean is going to be bicycling 83 miles in the Pan Mass Challenge in August, raising money for cancer research. Her profile is at http:// www.pmc.org/mypmc/profiles.asp?Section=story&eGiftID=JS0417

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Fwd: Re: Meta e-mail
by steve v 27 Jul '05

27 Jul '05

Fwd - thought this was on-list. --- steve v <vertigosteve(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > From: steve v > Subject: Re: Meta e-mail > To: Irate > > Anthere gives the reason as "uncooperative," and Im > not going to second guess her decision. If you > explain > yourself here, there's a good chance that you can be > unblocked early. Should "uncooperative" behaviour > continue, meta's rules for blocking and banning are > up > to the sysops there, as they deem someone to be > disruptive with normal developments there. > > IOW, wikis are collaborative web > communities--cooperation and sense of community are > necessary, although just plain civility will often > suffice. > > SV > > > --- Irate wrote: > > > > > I have been blocked by Anthere. With no > explnation, > > other than Matt Crypto. I want tto be reenabled > now. > > and I would like to know why I was blocked. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

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Re: [WikiEN-l] Pipermail Privacy Concern
by Mark Ryan 27 Jul '05

27 Jul '05

On 7/26/05, andyl2004(a)sympatico.ca <andyl2004(a)sympatico.ca> wrote: > I really would like to avoid this problem in the future and either have these pipermail entries edited so as to remove my full name or have them hidden from search engines by having a "NOINDEX" command placed in the html codes for those pages. As list administrators, we don't have a "delete archived message" or "edit archived message" button. For us to modify the archives, we need a member of the Wikimedia Technical Support Crew to directly modify the entries on the server. Which is a hell of a lot of trouble, and is obviously only reserved for the most serious of breaches of privacy. If you still wish for them to rectify this, contact them on their mailing list, which you can subscribe to at the following address: http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l ~Mark Ryan

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userpage and user subpage protection
by Jtkiefer 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

I know that there have been discussions about this in the past and that this subject has been controversial, however for the life of me I have not been able to find a full discussion on this so I thought I'd ask here what the whole issue is with subpage and userpage protection and why is it so controversial and disputed? -Jtkiefer

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Criticism of Islam being suppressed at Wiki
by T. Khan 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

I have been blocked by Administrator SlimVirgin for an indefinate period. The charge is that I have created Sock puppets to get around the 3RR policy on the Islam page. I have done no such thing. Islam page is controversial because Islam is controversial these days. Islam would not be controversial if muslim had not gone around beheading infidels on TV, suicide bombing in London, Madrid, Kashmir, and today Egypt. I have been advocating including a link to a Ex-Muslim site directory that contains links to many anti-Islam sites. Instead of attempting to discuss this on the talk page, the action has been to ban myself, who is not an ex-muslim, and others who are for an indefinate period. I am new to the Wiki routine and hence do not know the proper protocols to follow, but I do know that free speech dies when attempts to quash criticism is not given the maximum exposure in every possible venue ... hence this letter. I wish nothing but the best for Wiki, and I hope that this matter will be resolved to the open Wiki standards. Thanks for reading, Nickbee. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: Re: [WikiEN-l] Pipermail Privacy Concern
by andyl2004＠sympatico.ca 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

Does this mean the pages will be modified or are you suggesting I practice some trancendental meditation? A > From: steve v <vertigosteve(a)yahoo.com> > Date: 2005/07/25 Mon PM 09:14:01 EST > To: English Wikipedia <wikien-l(a)Wikipedia.org> > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Pipermail Privacy Concern > > Don't worry about it. > > SV > > --- andyl2004(a)sympatico.ca wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I'm a bit concerned because two wikien-l emails > > contained in the online archives at pipermail have > > my full name and I believe these pages have been > > "googled" in the past by individuals angry at the > > content of articles. I've been harassed as a result > > by two individuals in the past few months. > > > > I really would like to avoid this problem in the > > future and either have these pipermail entries > > edited so as to remove my full name or have them > > hidden from search engines by having a "NOINDEX" > > command placed in the html codes for those pages. > > > > The pages in question are > > > http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2004-April/012194.html > > > http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2004-April/012194.html > > (previous entry title) > > > > If this can be attended to I would be very grateful. > > > > Thanks, > > > > AL > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > WikiEN-l mailing list > > WikiEN-l(a)Wikipedia.org > > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > _______________________________________________ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l(a)Wikipedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l >

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Re: Consensus
by Daniel P. B. Smith 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

> From: "Charles Matthews" <charles.r.matthews(a)ntlworld.com> > > "Dan Grey" wrote > >> "Consensus" can only mean everyone agrees - and when the hell that >> does that happen? Next to never. > > Consensus may be a slightly fuzzy term, but it doesn't mean that. > In fact > WP's standard way of operating is a rather good illustration of > what it does > mean: a mixture across the community of those who are largely > agreed, some > who disagree but 'agree to disagree' without disaffection, those > who don't > agree but give low priority to the given issue, those who disagree > strongly > but concede that there is a community view and respect it on that > level, > some vocal and unreconciled folk, some who operate 'outside the > law'. You > find out whether you have consensus, if not unanimity, when you try > to build > on it. > > Charles Well said! -- Jean is going to be bicycling 83 miles in the Pan Mass Challenge in August, raising money for cancer research. Her profile is at http:// www.pmc.org/mypmc/profiles.asp?Section=story&eGiftID=JS0417

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Re: Re: [WikiEN-l] Pipermail Privacy Concern
by Jack Lynch 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

http://www.behind-the-tm-facade.org/Transcendental_Meditation-myths.htm I think some mattress hopping might do you some good, yes. Jack (Sam Spade) On 7/26/05, andyl2004(a)sympatico.ca <andyl2004(a)sympatico.ca> wrote: > are you suggesting I practice some trancendental > meditation?

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Re: Template:Libertarianism
by Frank Pinter 26 Jul '05

26 Jul '05

On 7/24/05, steve v <vertigosteve(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > Is it just me, or is this thing just plain overused? > Make a nice "pruning project" maybe? Generally, series boxes are limited to articles within that series (as defined by inclusion in the box). That may be a good direction here. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Whatlinkshere/Template:Libertarianism > > SV > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > Frank (User:Wikiacc) -- Double-ROT13 Encoded - circumvention will be prosecuted.

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WikiEN-l July 2005