Hey everyone, After wikimania, I decided to contribute to wikipedia in my capacity. The first thing I did was to check out my home town in wiki data, which is Zara Turkey.
I used the search box, and found that Zara is not listed there. So I used the option "containing Zara" which did help me find the right entry.
By the way, I see a tremendous impact of automatically generating descriptions, which is what was proposed by the gentlemen next to me in our outdoors meeting in wikimania. There were 4 Zara entries with no descriptions making it difficult for me to find the correct entry.
In my opinion, I think manual descriptions should be kept, as opposed to be deleted completely. Instead, automatically generated descriptions should be provided when there is no manual description and people should be asked to override automatically generated descriptions. In other words, provide a default one and let people change it, if for some reason it is not good enough.
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q147630 I realized that, it is labeled as "Zara, Turkey" and not Zara. This seem wrong to me, since "Turkey" part of this label is already in the data as a country relation. It appears to be a one-to-one mapping of the wikipedia article's title. Maybe when first imported from wikipedia, its title is used as is. I want to verify my understanding that labels of entities should be as short as possible and should not attempt to disambiguate as it has to be done in wikipedia article titles.
Thanks
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 6:26 PM, Sezgin Sucu sezsucu@gmail.com wrote:
Hey everyone, After wikimania, I decided to contribute to wikipedia in my capacity. The first thing I did was to check out my home town in wiki data, which is Zara Turkey.
I used the search box, and found that Zara is not listed there. So I used the option "containing Zara" which did help me find the right entry.
I really cannot replicate your experience. When I look at the search box, I do find Zara there. And I have no idea where the option "containing Zara" would be, so I can't know how to use it...
By the way, I see a tremendous impact of automatically generating descriptions, which is what was proposed by the gentlemen next to me in our outdoors meeting in wikimania. There were 4 Zara entries with no descriptions making it difficult for me to find the correct entry.
In my opinion, I think manual descriptions should be kept, as opposed to be deleted completely. Instead, automatically generated descriptions should be provided when there is no manual description and people should be asked to override automatically generated descriptions. In other words, provide a default one and let people change it, if for some reason it is not good enough.
Are you sure someone is proposing deleting them? I think you're fighting a strawman here.
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q147630 I realized that, it is labeled as "Zara, Turkey" and not Zara. This seem wrong to me, since "Turkey" part of this label is already in the data as a country relation. It appears to be a one-to-one mapping of the wikipedia article's title. Maybe when first imported from wikipedia, its title is used as is. I want to verify my understanding that labels of entities should be as short as possible and should not attempt to disambiguate as it has to be done in wikipedia article titles.
Again, you seem to be fighting a rule that does not exist. That the title is "Zara, Turkey" is indeed because it is copied from the Wikipedia article by that name, but Wikidata welcomes human as well as automated edits, and I do agree that just "Zara", with Turkey mentioned in the description, not the title, would be better. However, a general rules as you specify here would not be a good idea - I do prefer "United Nations" rather than "UN" as a title, for example. For now I would like to go with "be bold and use common sense".
On 12 August 2014 22:49, Andre Engels andreengels@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 6:26 PM, Sezgin Sucu sezsucu@gmail.com wrote:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q147630 I realized that, it is labeled as "Zara, Turkey" and not Zara. This seem wrong to me, since "Turkey" part of this label is already in the data as a country relation. It appears to be a one-to-one mapping of the wikipedia article's title. Maybe when first imported from wikipedia, its title is used as is. I want to verify my understanding that labels of entities should be as short as possible and should not attempt to disambiguate as it has to be done in wikipedia article titles.
Again, you seem to be fighting a rule that does not exist. That the title is "Zara, Turkey" is indeed because it is copied from the Wikipedia article by that name, but Wikidata welcomes human as well as automated edits, and I do agree that just "Zara", with Turkey mentioned in the description, not the title, would be better.
Agree. I believe a lot of the importing did try and remove disambiguation - however, they restricted themselves to cases like:
WP: Zara (Turkey) > WD label: Zara
In this case, it's obvious that everything after the comma is a disambiguation note, but there are many articles where the commas form part of the name and so you can't trim automatically - a good example is "Ross, Skye and Lochaber (UK Parliament constituency)", which should definitely be "Ross, Skye and Lochaber" not "Ross" :-)
On 12.08.2014 23:49, Andre Engels wrote: ...
In my opinion, I think manual descriptions should be kept, as opposed to be deleted completely. Instead, automatically generated descriptions should be provided when there is no manual description and people should be asked to override automatically generated descriptions. In other words, provide a default one and let people change it, if for some reason it is not good enough.
Are you sure someone is proposing deleting them? I think you're fighting a strawman here.
Well, this was actually really a bit of a contentious issue at the meeting that Sezgin is referring to ;-). However, we were all impressed by the automated labels, and even if there was some discussion whether (and how often) the manual description would be preferable, I saw a lot of agreement that the automated descriptions would be much better than empty labels. The proposal that Sezgin was making would be one way to implement this (possibly with a high chance of wide consensus; I would certainly welcome something like that).
Secondly, Denny is absolutely right: having more labels would be of huge value in almost any language (even in English). So welcome again to Wikidata! :-)
Cheers
Markus
Hey Sezgin,
welcome to Wikidata! It is great to have new contributors. I assume you speak Turkish, and maybe other languages? Then working on labels in your language will be an awesome help. Be sure to set up your User page with a Babel infobox where you set your languages - it will make it easier for you to contribute labels to Wikidata while you surf it. (If you don't know how, ask)
Yes, you are completely right with regards to the Label for Zara, Turkey. It should just be Zara, and the description probably "city in Turkey". Just go ahead and change it (if no one else did that already).
Descriptions can and are often automatically generated, by bots and then added to Wikidata. If you are good at creating descriptions, and maybe writing bots, you are very welcome to do so and then go to Wikidata to ask for permission to run the bot. More descriptions would be awesome!
Thank you for joining Wikidata, I am looking forward to see the project grow with your help.
Cheers, Denny
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sezgin Sucu sezsucu@gmail.com wrote:
Hey everyone, After wikimania, I decided to contribute to wikipedia in my capacity. The first thing I did was to check out my home town in wiki data, which is Zara Turkey.
I used the search box, and found that Zara is not listed there. So I used the option "containing Zara" which did help me find the right entry.
By the way, I see a tremendous impact of automatically generating descriptions, which is what was proposed by the gentlemen next to me in our outdoors meeting in wikimania. There were 4 Zara entries with no descriptions making it difficult for me to find the correct entry.
In my opinion, I think manual descriptions should be kept, as opposed to be deleted completely. Instead, automatically generated descriptions should be provided when there is no manual description and people should be asked to override automatically generated descriptions. In other words, provide a default one and let people change it, if for some reason it is not good enough.
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q147630 I realized that, it is labeled as "Zara, Turkey" and not Zara. This seem wrong to me, since "Turkey" part of this label is already in the data as a country relation. It appears to be a one-to-one mapping of the wikipedia article's title. Maybe when first imported from wikipedia, its title is used as is. I want to verify my understanding that labels of entities should be as short as possible and should not attempt to disambiguate as it has to be done in wikipedia article titles.
Thanks
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 10:30 AM, Denny Vrandečić vrandecic@google.com wrote:
Yes, you are completely right with regards to the Label for Zara, Turkey. It should just be Zara, and the description probably "city in Turkey". Just go ahead and change it (if no one else did that already).
Though, remember that we can also add "Zara, Turkey" as an alias to an item with the label "Zara". Because the Wikipedia article has that name, people might try to search for it like that and it doesn't hurt to add labels if needed.
Also, a tip: you can easily get to the Wikidata item from any Wikipedia article. Each article connected to Wikidata has two main links to the Wikidata item: (1) at the end of the interwiki list under "Edit links", and (2) in the "Tools" part of the sidebar under "Wikidata item". Those might come in handy while Wikidata is being developed.