Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say: * the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally generic templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item * a more specific query "living organism" * another even more specific query like "animal" * ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally generic
templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally generic
templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally generic
templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
not to mention the simple fact that Wikidata has way more Flemish painters than are in the English Wikipedia's list, for example just look at this query for painters born in Antwerp: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=claim%5B106%3A1028181%5D%...
On Thu, Jan 1, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com wrote:
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally generic
templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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Mmm I'm not sure we are talking of the initial subject anymore.
Placeholder and queries are (will be) generic tools. The idea that a WikiTemplate can be used to generate a stub article is also generic, and Wikibase works as a very generic level.
The fact that a list article can potentially generated by a query is also true. The fact that several list article can countain link to the same article is also true.
This imply that, if you map a template to a query and want to generate a stub article for a Wikipedian that search a subject that as no article with this template and the information that are on Wikidata about that subject, you might have several candidate template that the system would be aware of.
For example if he searches is a scientist there is several infobox that could fit, the person infobox or the scientist one. The scientist infobox is the most specific one but we need a way in the generic placeholder article with this template in priority, assuming the idea is the rigth one of course.
2015-01-01 17:02 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
not to mention the simple fact that Wikidata has way more Flemish painters than are in the English Wikipedia's list, for example just look at this query for painters born in Antwerp:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=claim%5B106%3A1028181%5D%...
On Thu, Jan 1, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
wrote:
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally
generic templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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Hoi, You do not make sense to me. A query is something I understand. What you are saying about templates and list articles is very much "wishful thinking". It bears no relation to anything I know.
I really wonder how universal or practical your ideas are. To me it seems very one dimensional and very much in line with article thinking. What are templates for you. Where are they defined?? Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 18:25, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Mmm I'm not sure we are talking of the initial subject anymore.
Placeholder and queries are (will be) generic tools. The idea that a WikiTemplate can be used to generate a stub article is also generic, and Wikibase works as a very generic level.
The fact that a list article can potentially generated by a query is also true. The fact that several list article can countain link to the same article is also true.
This imply that, if you map a template to a query and want to generate a stub article for a Wikipedian that search a subject that as no article with this template and the information that are on Wikidata about that subject, you might have several candidate template that the system would be aware of.
For example if he searches is a scientist there is several infobox that could fit, the person infobox or the scientist one. The scientist infobox is the most specific one but we need a way in the generic placeholder article with this template in priority, assuming the idea is the rigth one of course.
2015-01-01 17:02 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
not to mention the simple fact that Wikidata has way more Flemish painters than are in the English Wikipedia's list, for example just look at this query for painters born in Antwerp:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=claim%5B106%3A1028181%5D%...
On Thu, Jan 1, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Gerard Meijssen < gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> wrote:
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard <thomas.douillard@gmail.com
wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles.
One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say:
- the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally
generic templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that shows all the claims about this item
- a more specific query "living organism"
- another even more specific query like "animal"
- ...
In this example each more specific query results is obviously a subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose the template of the most specific one.
In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea.
Any thoughts about this problem ?
Cheers, TomT0m
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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Hi, I exposed my view of how placeholder articles should work in a page where you contributed, maybe you did not read it as you are not really fond of the idea, see this diff https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Article_placeholder_input&diff=prev&oldid=184600147 .
Templates in a wikimedian context are wikitemplates like infobox, those who are defined in the "Template:" namespace in mediawiki wikis. They are used to generate infoboxes, they could as well be used to generate placeholder articles, think of code like "Template:stub human template"
{{property:name}} is a person of {{property:country}} {{infobox person}}
to generate a stub article for people with no Wikipedia article, pretty much like Reasonator does.
But there may be several templates of that kind who could generate stub articles. The idea is that a way to select the appropriate template for some kind of items is to use Wikibase queries. For example to say that if the item is in the result set of the query "all instances of human'', then the template "Template:stub human template" is appropriate to generate the stub article.
2015-01-01 18:38 GMT+01:00 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com:
Hoi, You do not make sense to me. A query is something I understand. What you are saying about templates and list articles is very much "wishful thinking". It bears no relation to anything I know.
I really wonder how universal or practical your ideas are. To me it seems very one dimensional and very much in line with article thinking. What are templates for you. Where are they defined?? Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 18:25, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Mmm I'm not sure we are talking of the initial subject anymore.
Placeholder and queries are (will be) generic tools. The idea that a WikiTemplate can be used to generate a stub article is also generic, and Wikibase works as a very generic level.
The fact that a list article can potentially generated by a query is also true. The fact that several list article can countain link to the same article is also true.
This imply that, if you map a template to a query and want to generate a stub article for a Wikipedian that search a subject that as no article with this template and the information that are on Wikidata about that subject, you might have several candidate template that the system would be aware of.
For example if he searches is a scientist there is several infobox that could fit, the person infobox or the scientist one. The scientist infobox is the most specific one but we need a way in the generic placeholder article with this template in priority, assuming the idea is the rigth one of course.
2015-01-01 17:02 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
not to mention the simple fact that Wikidata has way more Flemish painters than are in the English Wikipedia's list, for example just look at this query for painters born in Antwerp:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=claim%5B106%3A1028181%5D%...
On Thu, Jan 1, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Gerard Meijssen < gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> wrote:
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to keep redlinks from being deleted: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters
Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php
On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related > to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles. > > One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates > are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the > result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say: > * the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally > generic templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that > shows all the claims about this item > * a more specific query "living organism" > * another even more specific query like "animal" > * ... > > In this example each more specific query results is obviously a > subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose > the template of the most specific one. > > In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or > reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a > meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using > raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea. > > Any thoughts about this problem ? > > Cheers, TomT0m > > _______________________________________________ > Wikidata-l mailing list > Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l > >
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Hoi, Actually I am a big fan of generated text. I blogged about it several times. One thing I want is that those articles are cached. That the mechanism is truly multi lingual. When templates are single language only, they are not a Wikidata solution. Now that is a prerequisite a Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 18:57, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Hi, I exposed my view of how placeholder articles should work in a page where you contributed, maybe you did not read it as you are not really fond of the idea, see this diff https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Article_placeholder_input&diff=prev&oldid=184600147 .
Templates in a wikimedian context are wikitemplates like infobox, those who are defined in the "Template:" namespace in mediawiki wikis. They are used to generate infoboxes, they could as well be used to generate placeholder articles, think of code like "Template:stub human template"
{{property:name}} is a person of {{property:country}} {{infobox person}}
to generate a stub article for people with no Wikipedia article, pretty much like Reasonator does.
But there may be several templates of that kind who could generate stub articles. The idea is that a way to select the appropriate template for some kind of items is to use Wikibase queries. For example to say that if the item is in the result set of the query "all instances of human'', then the template "Template:stub human template" is appropriate to generate the stub article.
2015-01-01 18:38 GMT+01:00 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com:
Hoi, You do not make sense to me. A query is something I understand. What you are saying about templates and list articles is very much "wishful thinking". It bears no relation to anything I know.
I really wonder how universal or practical your ideas are. To me it seems very one dimensional and very much in line with article thinking. What are templates for you. Where are they defined?? Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 18:25, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Mmm I'm not sure we are talking of the initial subject anymore.
Placeholder and queries are (will be) generic tools. The idea that a WikiTemplate can be used to generate a stub article is also generic, and Wikibase works as a very generic level.
The fact that a list article can potentially generated by a query is also true. The fact that several list article can countain link to the same article is also true.
This imply that, if you map a template to a query and want to generate a stub article for a Wikipedian that search a subject that as no article with this template and the information that are on Wikidata about that subject, you might have several candidate template that the system would be aware of.
For example if he searches is a scientist there is several infobox that could fit, the person infobox or the scientist one. The scientist infobox is the most specific one but we need a way in the generic placeholder article with this template in priority, assuming the idea is the rigth one of course.
2015-01-01 17:02 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
not to mention the simple fact that Wikidata has way more Flemish painters than are in the English Wikipedia's list, for example just look at this query for painters born in Antwerp:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=claim%5B106%3A1028181%5D%...
On Thu, Jan 1, 2015 at 1:29 PM, Gerard Meijssen < gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> wrote:
Hoi, For the list "Flemish surrealist painters" there is no intersection between "Flemish painter" or with "Surrealist painters". That list is in and of itself an article in a Wikipedia. In Wikidata you want the two properties separate so that you can be surprised with who fits in a list. It is not deterministic. Thanks, GerardM
On 1 January 2015 at 13:23, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
I don't think so. There always be intersections beetween lists. One of the Flemish painter might also be in the list of surrealist painters.
2014-12-30 14:41 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
> I would suggest you are thinking from the wrong perspective. Think > specific, and work your way from there. On the English Wikipedia, there are > tons of lists which each have their own set of rules for list items. This > makes a specific query much easier, tied to the list item on Wikidata. For > example, take a look at this list which uses a motley crew of references to > keep redlinks from being deleted: > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Flemish_painters > > Wikidata has well filled items for most of those redlinks, for which > articles could be created using the PrepBio tool: > http://tools.wmflabs.org/magnustools/prepbio.php > > On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Thomas Douillard < > thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hi, I got an open question about Wikidata concepts, partly related >> to the idea of selecting a templates wrt. a query for placeholder articles. >> >> One question about this idea is : what to do when several templates >> are possible for an item, for example the item with no article is in the >> result set of several queries associated with article stubs templates, say: >> * the query "anything", that could be associated with a totally >> generic templates that shows a Wikibase page like article templates that >> shows all the claims about this item >> * a more specific query "living organism" >> * another even more specific query like "animal" >> * ... >> >> In this example each more specific query results is obviously a >> subset of each more generic one. In such cases it could be useful to choose >> the template of the most specific one. >> >> In the same spirit of the "subclass of" property we can create (or >> reuse it) for the queries. But as no property has in Wikibase itself a >> meaning, this means the choice of the template would not be possible using >> raw Wikibase concepts, which partly breaks the interests of the idea. >> >> Any thoughts about this problem ? >> >> Cheers, TomT0m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikidata-l mailing list >> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Wikidata-l mailing list > Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l > >
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Generated a grammatically correct same meaning sentence in all language in the planet automatically is way more difficult than finding a user that will write a template is his own language.
Actually, I would posit that the inverse of that statement is true
On Fri, Jan 2, 2015 at 10:26 AM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Generated a grammatically correct same meaning sentence in all language in the planet automatically is way more difficult than finding a user that will write a template is his own language.
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I took a random language on rasonator : https://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?q=Q14560&lang=bi result : everything seem to be in english ...
That's for the translation of simple terms. I have pretty much no idea of the grammar of that language. If youwant to generate a simple sentence "subject, verb, complement" you need a model of that language, which is probably a reasearch subject for linguists. I think it is simpler to find a user who talk this language and let him team up with a wikitemplate programmer than to build a software that is aware of the grammar of a lot of languages, with a formal model of the grammar and so on :)
But I admit this is disputable :)
2015-01-02 10:58 GMT+01:00 Jane Darnell jane023@gmail.com:
Actually, I would posit that the inverse of that statement is true
On Fri, Jan 2, 2015 at 10:26 AM, Thomas Douillard < thomas.douillard@gmail.com> wrote:
Generated a grammatically correct same meaning sentence in all language in the planet automatically is way more difficult than finding a user that will write a template is his own language.
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Hoi, Absolutely. However, creating functionality that is useful in any language for any subject beats considering templates that are useful for only about one project. Also automated text is something beyond what templates may offer or what Reasonator offers.
Reasonator and its approach is superior because it provides information on the strength of the available labels and the ability to understand other languages. Templates fall short in every way in that respects.
I am all in favour of understanding what templates are, what queries are, the restrictions in either but I am not willing to consider templates a real solution that works for Wikidata. Thanks, GerardM
On 2 January 2015 at 10:26, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Generated a grammatically correct same meaning sentence in all language in the planet automatically is way more difficult than finding a user that will write a template is his own language.
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Templates can also be coded in lua, which is comparable to javascript in expressivity. It's not so hard to code a generic lua template that could act as reasonator, multilingual and that could be imported into every language versions of Wikipedia.
Here is the interesting thing : this generic version could be, in my proposition, associated to the query "every item", so it is totally compatible. But every wikipedia could also overload the mechanism by associating language specific versions of the template for specific kind on item.
This leads us to the original question of this thread, as every query's results is a subset of the result of the query "every item on WIkidata".
2015-01-02 16:08 GMT+01:00 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com:
Hoi, Absolutely. However, creating functionality that is useful in any language for any subject beats considering templates that are useful for only about one project. Also automated text is something beyond what templates may offer or what Reasonator offers.
Reasonator and its approach is superior because it provides information on the strength of the available labels and the ability to understand other languages. Templates fall short in every way in that respects.
I am all in favour of understanding what templates are, what queries are, the restrictions in either but I am not willing to consider templates a real solution that works for Wikidata. Thanks, GerardM
On 2 January 2015 at 10:26, Thomas Douillard thomas.douillard@gmail.com wrote:
Generated a grammatically correct same meaning sentence in all language in the planet automatically is way more difficult than finding a user that will write a template is his own language.
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