Thanks for raising this, Rob. Some comments inline. [+Stephen, who is now
leading on the structured metadata for multimedia project]
On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 1:59 PM, Rob Lanphier <robla(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:
(+cc Nemo and Wikidata-tech)
On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 5:33 AM, Gergo Tisza <gtisza(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:
On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 2:49 AM, Rob Lanphier
<robla(a)wikimedia.org>
wrote:
There's an item that's Luis Villa added
to the MW Core backlog that I'd
like to move to the Multimedia backlog:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_MediaWiki_Core_Team/Backlog#Struct…
I'm assuming everything that he describes fits nicely into what is
planned for Structured Data. Assuming that's true, should I just
copy/paste into a new card in Mingle, or a new page on
mw.org or what?
This seems to be about article text, or mainly about article text
(articles imported from other wikis and so on).
Yeah, that's correct. I hadn't raised it myself in the metadata
context for
exactly that reason. But certainly there is a lot of overlap between
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Files_and_licenses_concept
and
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Multimedia/Structured_Data
Even if the goals aren't completely the same, if nothing else, some of the
schemas should really be made to line up.
The plan for the structured data project is to create
Wikidata properties
for legalese, install Wikibase on Commons (and
possibly other wikis which
have local images), make that Wikibase use Wikidata properties (and
sometimes Wikidata items as values), create a new entity type called
mediainfo (which is like a Wikibase item, but associated with a file), and
add legal information to the mediainfo entries.
Part of that (the Wikidata properties) could be reused for articles and
other non-file content - the source, license etc. properties are generic
enough. However, if we want to use this structure to attribute files, we
would either have to make mediainfo into some more generic thing that can
be attached to any wiki page, or abuse the langlink/badge feature to serve
a similar purpose. That is a major course correction; if we want to do
something like that, that should be discussed (with the involvement of the
Wikidata team) as soon as possible.
Thanks for the analysis, Gergo! I was going to split Luis' proposal into
a separate wiki page, but I see Nemo has linked to this page as the "Canonical
page on the topic":
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Files_and_licenses_concept
Without a deep reading that I'm admittedly just not going to have time
for, it's hard to tell how related the page that Nemo linked to is to the
concepts that Luis is trying to capture.
Seems to address part but not all of them, if I understand correctly:
- *non-editing authors:* Does seem to be able to cope with the idea of
authors who aren't in the edit history (e.g., because they edited a prior
version of the work that was uploaded as a seed to the wiki)
- *source: *Doesn't seem to have the notion that a work might have an
alternate source (e.g., something copied/pasted in from another CC BY-SA
source).
- *license:* not clear if this copes with the notion that there might be
multiple compatible licenses on the page.
One thing I'll note, though, before we get too
complacent in thinking that
files are somehow simpler than articles, we should consider these
relatively common scenarios:
* Group photo with potentially different per-person personality rights
* PDF of a slide deck with many images
* PDF of a Wikipedia article :-)
Or simply the case of "I copied and pasted an article from a different CC
source into the Wikipedia article" - that's what got me thinking about this
a while back (though of course, as Nemo points out, PDFs are the canonical
problem child here).
Luis
--
Luis Villa
Deputy General Counsel
Wikimedia Foundation
415.839.6885 ext. 6810
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