---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com Date: Apr 25, 2006 7:16 PM Subject: Re: [Toolserver-l] new login server To: River Tarnell river@attenuate.org

On 4/25/06, River Tarnell river@attenuate.org wrote:

Gregory Maxwell:

...

Your feelings on Linux mirror mine on Solaris.

that's fine - i understand other people don't like Solaris, but until (very) recently, no-one was interested in doing *anything* with Zedler except me. and i prefer Solaris, so that's what it uses :)

:) As I said, my position is a mirror of yours.

...

Division of labor? The work I'm most excited about (other than my own projects) is helping with on toolserver is basically training toolserver users, creating tool parts and tools to make tools.. Front end stuff.

are you fine with running Solaris in that case (as an end-user), or do you still prefer Linux? recently i'm more interested in back-end administration, and leaving user support to other people, especially since other people have root/database access.

Still prefer Linux. In particular, there are packages which require lots of kicking to get them to compile on modern Solaris. Once you get into the game of chasing dependencies which packages will assume are installed by default because the linux systems come with them, it can become fairly annoying. This bit me with a recent version of [[R_programming_language]] for example. Toolserver has been a lesson for me in the poor portablity of much of the software I use locally.

i've tried to make zedler "Linux-user-friendly" as far as installing GNU tools and so on goes. if something is missing here, i'm happy to try to fix it. (i haven't heard any complaints from users about this recently, but i understand people are sometimes unwilling to complaing about 'charity' services--please /do/ tell me if something is still not acceptable to most users.)

The first thing I've always done with Solaris is install the GNU tools. So doing so wasn't just an improvement, it was necessary from my perspective. :)

When you were in IRC a often I'd nag you for a python module here or there or the like, but you weren't around much for a little while... A lot of the problems I ran into were minor, or were atleast just as hard for me to fix as you. As such I would have felt silly nagging you, when I wasn't interested in doing the work myself.

For most of the bot datacollection and offline reporting I simply began splitting my apps up into two parts, a backend which talked to the database and packaged content up, and then the rest which would produce graphs and other analysis... I'd run the second half on one of my colo boxes, and they'd communicate over a ssh tunneled socket. Configuring that was easier the the annoyance of getting things that 'just work' (tm) going on toolserver.

i am fine with acting as a sysadmin for Zedler with Solaris and leaving everything else (including database) to other people--in fact, that's pretty much what i do now.

if you (or DaB, or maybe someone else, if it's someone we can trust) is okay with handing over the login server, and running some form of Linux on it, i'm also fine with that. but in that case i won't be putting any effort into it at all (although i will continue to run the DB server.)

I'd be quite willing to take sole or nearly sole authority for it if it were running some form of Linux (I don't much care, are the rest of the Wikimedia boxes Fedora? I'm most comfortable with RHES and Fedora these days, but I've also admined Debian and SUSE boxes). However, I wouldn't want to do that unless I got support from another admin. I'm fully prepared to put in the work to support it, but I don't want to leave everyone with "Greg's science project" if I have a personal crisis and vanish for a while. :)

I think the users would be fine (and I suspect, if they are like me) welcome such a change. I have no problem helping them with that.. because as I said, playing the role of meta-toolmaker appeals to me.