A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
This article has multiple issues.
I don't think we've posted articles that greet people with that before.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Michael Guss mguss@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander < jalexander@wikimedia.org> wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Michael Guss Research Analyst Wikimediafoundation.org mguss@wikimedia.org
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Also, you should say where - China is not mentioned anywhere in the tweet.
mobile. On Nov 11, 2015 12:31 PM, "Jeff Elder" jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
This article has multiple issues.
I don't think we've posted articles that greet people with that before.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Michael Guss mguss@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander < jalexander@wikimedia.org> wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Michael Guss Research Analyst Wikimediafoundation.org mguss@wikimedia.org
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Yeah, I'd personally not be in favor of pointing people to pages with large cleanup banners right at the top.
--Ed
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 3:38 PM, Katherine Maher kmaher@wikimedia.org wrote:
Also, you should say where - China is not mentioned anywhere in the tweet.
mobile. On Nov 11, 2015 12:31 PM, "Jeff Elder" jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
This article has multiple issues.
I don't think we've posted articles that greet people with that before.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Michael Guss mguss@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander < jalexander@wikimedia.org> wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Michael Guss Research Analyst Wikimediafoundation.org mguss@wikimedia.org
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
James Alexander Manager Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation (415) 839-6885 x6716 @jamesofur
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:46 PM, Ed Erhart eerhart@wikimedia.org wrote:
Yeah, I'd personally not be in favor of pointing people to pages with large cleanup banners right at the top.
--Ed
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 3:38 PM, Katherine Maher kmaher@wikimedia.org wrote:
Also, you should say where - China is not mentioned anywhere in the tweet.
mobile. On Nov 11, 2015 12:31 PM, "Jeff Elder" jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
This article has multiple issues.
I don't think we've posted articles that greet people with that before.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Michael Guss mguss@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander < jalexander@wikimedia.org> wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Michael Guss Research Analyst Wikimediafoundation.org mguss@wikimedia.org
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Ed Erhart Editorial Associate Wikimedia Foundation
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
OK, thanks for the idea, James. I think you're right that a policy may be needed. I'll add to the best practices doc. It seems like a common-sense boundary to me.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:09 PM, James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org wrote:
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
James Alexander Manager Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation (415) 839-6885 x6716 @jamesofur
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:46 PM, Ed Erhart eerhart@wikimedia.org wrote:
Yeah, I'd personally not be in favor of pointing people to pages with large cleanup banners right at the top.
--Ed
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 3:38 PM, Katherine Maher kmaher@wikimedia.org wrote:
Also, you should say where - China is not mentioned anywhere in the tweet.
mobile. On Nov 11, 2015 12:31 PM, "Jeff Elder" jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
This article has multiple issues.
I don't think we've posted articles that greet people with that before.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Michael Guss mguss@wikimedia.org wrote:
Hey there,
LGTM.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 11:55 AM, James Alexander < jalexander@wikimedia.org> wrote:
A bit different, further field from our usual american/european fare (though we, and our SM sites, are blocked on the mainland usually) . The black friday of china :)
Thoughts:
T: What started as a celebration for singles became the largest online shopping day in the world. Happy #SinglesDay! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
F: Did you know that what started as a university celebration for single students has became the largest online shopping day in the world? How would you celebrate 11/11? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singles_Day
Sent from my iPhone
James Alexander Manager, Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation +1 415-839-6885 x6716
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Michael Guss Research Analyst Wikimediafoundation.org mguss@wikimedia.org
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
-- Ed Erhart Editorial Associate Wikimedia Foundation
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
2015-11-11 22:09 GMT+01:00 James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org:
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
(Hi everyone. I normally don't comment. Some of you know me from other lists, meetings, or, well, because we work together.)
It all depends on what the purpose of our social media is, of course. My opinion is that one of the greatest problems of Wikipedia is the declining number of editors on many language versions, often attributed (among other things) to the fact that it's more difficult to find articles to edit, as a lot of the low-hanging fruit is gone. In that situation, I certainly see a point in every now and then linking to an article that is decent and will supply the information promised in the tweet but has visible problems, to remind people that, yes, there're certainly things left do and they're very welcome to take part. Only linking to good material might reinforce the idea that someone else is taking care of the problem.
//Johan Jönsson --
Thanks for those excellent thoughts, Johan. I think we can indeed tweet to articles that need help. (We're figuring that out with Wikipedian on this list, as a matter of fact.) But I don't think we can tweet the viability of content (as in stating facts), and then send people to pages that question those facts in the interests of encouraging editing.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:40 PM, Johan Jönsson brevlistor@gmail.com wrote:
2015-11-11 22:09 GMT+01:00 James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org:
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
(Hi everyone. I normally don't comment. Some of you know me from other lists, meetings, or, well, because we work together.)
It all depends on what the purpose of our social media is, of course. My opinion is that one of the greatest problems of Wikipedia is the declining number of editors on many language versions, often attributed (among other things) to the fact that it's more difficult to find articles to edit, as a lot of the low-hanging fruit is gone. In that situation, I certainly see a point in every now and then linking to an article that is decent and will supply the information promised in the tweet but has visible problems, to remind people that, yes, there're certainly things left do and they're very welcome to take part. Only linking to good material might reinforce the idea that someone else is taking care of the problem.
//Johan Jönsson
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
I'm not particularly concerned either way (as I said before) but for the record the facts actually mentioned were not in question and were fairly well sourced :). I do see both sides (and those banners are indeed fairly ugly... though when you make them small no one notices them which defeats their purpose), though I certainly lean more personally towards reminding people we're not done yet and not perfect.
James Alexander Manager Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation (415) 839-6885 x6716 @jamesofur
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:46 PM, Jeff Elder jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
Thanks for those excellent thoughts, Johan. I think we can indeed tweet to articles that need help. (We're figuring that out with Wikipedian on this list, as a matter of fact.) But I don't think we can tweet the viability of content (as in stating facts), and then send people to pages that question those facts in the interests of encouraging editing.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:40 PM, Johan Jönsson brevlistor@gmail.com wrote:
2015-11-11 22:09 GMT+01:00 James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org:
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
(Hi everyone. I normally don't comment. Some of you know me from other lists, meetings, or, well, because we work together.)
It all depends on what the purpose of our social media is, of course. My opinion is that one of the greatest problems of Wikipedia is the declining number of editors on many language versions, often attributed (among other things) to the fact that it's more difficult to find articles to edit, as a lot of the low-hanging fruit is gone. In that situation, I certainly see a point in every now and then linking to an article that is decent and will supply the information promised in the tweet but has visible problems, to remind people that, yes, there're certainly things left do and they're very welcome to take part. Only linking to good material might reinforce the idea that someone else is taking care of the problem.
//Johan Jönsson
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
We will absolutely remind people that they can edit! : )
I just think those messages need to be separate from posting our content. There's only so much each 140-character tweet can do, and I'm not sure we can simultaneously showcase specific content and use that same content to demonstrate that articles need work.
We have actually talked about this area a fair amount. Both are very important pillars of our social media, that's for sure.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 2:11 PM, James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org wrote:
I'm not particularly concerned either way (as I said before) but for the record the facts actually mentioned were not in question and were fairly well sourced :). I do see both sides (and those banners are indeed fairly ugly... though when you make them small no one notices them which defeats their purpose), though I certainly lean more personally towards reminding people we're not done yet and not perfect.
James Alexander Manager Trust & Safety Wikimedia Foundation (415) 839-6885 x6716 @jamesofur
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:46 PM, Jeff Elder jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
Thanks for those excellent thoughts, Johan. I think we can indeed tweet to articles that need help. (We're figuring that out with Wikipedian on this list, as a matter of fact.) But I don't think we can tweet the viability of content (as in stating facts), and then send people to pages that question those facts in the interests of encouraging editing.
Jeff Elder Digital communications manager Wikimedia Foundation 704-650-4130 @jeffelder https://twitter.com/JeffElder @wikipedia https://twitter.com/wikipedia The Wikimedia blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:40 PM, Johan Jönsson brevlistor@gmail.com wrote:
2015-11-11 22:09 GMT+01:00 James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org:
Certainly fine if we'd rather not (especially if we want to have it as a more concrete policy). On a personal front I'm generally of the opinion that if the article is relatively good from a reading standpoint the banners are ok and may actually remind people they can help clean it up. (also the mobile site strips the templates out... so I didn't see them)
(Hi everyone. I normally don't comment. Some of you know me from other lists, meetings, or, well, because we work together.)
It all depends on what the purpose of our social media is, of course. My opinion is that one of the greatest problems of Wikipedia is the declining number of editors on many language versions, often attributed (among other things) to the fact that it's more difficult to find articles to edit, as a lot of the low-hanging fruit is gone. In that situation, I certainly see a point in every now and then linking to an article that is decent and will supply the information promised in the tweet but has visible problems, to remind people that, yes, there're certainly things left do and they're very welcome to take part. Only linking to good material might reinforce the idea that someone else is taking care of the problem.
//Johan Jönsson
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
Social-media mailing list Social-media@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/social-media
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 2:17 PM, Jeff Elder jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will absolutely remind people that they can edit! : )
I just think those messages need to be separate from posting our content. There's only so much each 140-character tweet can do, and I'm not sure we can simultaneously showcase specific content and use that same content to demonstrate that articles need work.
Ahh, yes, this is where we disagree then :) apologies I hadn't quite seen the distinction. I have always been a fan of red links (links to articles that don't exist yet but probably should/could) and article notices and the like as reminders that someone can indeed edit. I think showing off our "not yet complete" content is a good thing and that it's sad if we only show off what we think of as unmarked articles (in the end many of them 'could' probably have notices/use more help they just haven't had someone add them yet or people are lying to themselves). That's fine however :) That's why we have lists like this for discussion and you/comms to make a decision rather then flipping back and forth depending on the whim of who happens to tweet that day.
I'm glad that you're thinking of how to call for edits through SM too, I do hope that we can find better ways to combine the two however. I think SM messages simply asking for edits are relatively boring even for someone who DOES edit a lot and I glaze over them, but it's incredibly common that I click a link because of some cool fact/note and then make a little edit or a change :).
2015-11-11 23:25 GMT+01:00 James Alexander jalexander@wikimedia.org:
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 2:17 PM, Jeff Elder jelder@wikimedia.org wrote:
We will absolutely remind people that they can edit! : )
I just think those messages need to be separate from posting our content. There's only so much each 140-character tweet can do, and I'm not sure we can simultaneously showcase specific content and use that same content to demonstrate that articles need work.
Ahh, yes, this is where we disagree then :) apologies I hadn't quite seen the distinction. I have always been a fan of red links (links to articles that don't exist yet but probably should/could) and article notices and the like as reminders that someone can indeed edit. I think showing off our "not yet complete" content is a good thing and that it's sad if we only show off what we think of as unmarked articles (in the end many of them 'could' probably have notices/use more help they just haven't had someone add them yet or people are lying to themselves). That's fine however :) That's why we have lists like this for discussion and you/comms to make a decision rather then flipping back and forth depending on the whim of who happens to tweet that day.
I'm glad that you're thinking of how to call for edits through SM too, I do hope that we can find better ways to combine the two however. I think SM messages simply asking for edits are relatively boring even for someone who DOES edit a lot and I glaze over them, but it's incredibly common that I click a link because of some cool fact/note and then make a little edit or a change :).
Like James, I'm not here for a crusade, and won't harp on about this, but I think there'd be a point to treating the obviously not perfect articles as perfectly normal. Yet again, it all depends on what we want to use social media for.
(Have we/you/Comms had that discussion, and are there any policy or strategy documents I could read, to avoid asking questions that have already been answered?)
//Johan Jönsson --
social-media@lists.wikimedia.org