Could there be<span></span> a way to have our nicely curated description cake and eat it too? For example, interpolating data into the description and/or marking data points which are referenced in the description (so as to mark it as outdated when they change)? <div><div><div><br></div><div>I appreciate the potential benefits of generated descriptions (and other things), but Monte&#39;s examples might have swayed me towards human curated—when available.</div><div><div><div><br>On Tuesday, August 18, 2015, Monte Hurd &lt;<a href="mailto:mhurd@wikimedia.org">mhurd@wikimedia.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Ok, so I just did what I proposed. I went to random enwiki articles and described the first ten I found which didn&#39;t already have descriptions:<div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div>- &quot;Courage Under Fire&quot;, <i>1996 film about a Gulf War friendly-fire incident</i><br></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Pebasiconcha immanis&quot;, <i>largest known species of land snail, extinct</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;List of Kenyan writers&quot;, <i>notable Kenyan authors</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Solar eclipse of December 14, 1917&quot;, <i>annular eclipse which lasted 77 seconds</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Natchaug Forest Lumber Shed&quot;, <i>historic Civilian Conservation Corps post-and-beam building</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Sun of Jamaica (album)&quot;, <i>debut 1980 studio album by Goombay Dance Band</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;E-1027&quot;, <i>modernist villa in France by architect Eileen Gray</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Daingerfield State Park&quot;, <i>park in Morris County, Texas, USA, bordering Lake Daingerfield</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Todo Lo Que Soy-En Vivo&quot;, <i>2014 Live album by Mexican pop singer Fey</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;2009 UEFA Regions&#39; Cup&quot;, <i>6th UEFA Regions&#39; Cup, won by Castile and Leon</i></div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>And here are the respective descriptions from Magnus&#39; (quite excellent) autodesc.js:</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div>- &quot;Courage Under Fire&quot;, <i>1996 film by Edward Zwick, produced by John Davis and David T. Friendly from United States of America</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Pebasiconcha immanis&quot;, <i>species of Mollusca</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;List of Kenyan writers&quot;, <i>Wikimedia list article</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Solar eclipse of December 14, 1917&quot;, <i>solar eclipse</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Natchaug Forest Lumber Shed&quot;, <i>Construction in Connecticut, United States of America</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Sun of Jamaica (album)&quot;, <i>album</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;E-1027&quot;, <i>villa in Roquebrune-Cap-Martin, France</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Daingerfield State Park&quot;, <i>state park and state park of a state of the United States in Texas, United States of America</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;Todo Lo Que Soy-En Vivo&quot;, <i>live album by Fey</i></div><div><br></div><div>- &quot;2009 UEFA Regions&#39; Cup&quot;, <i>none</i></div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Thoughts? </div><div><br></div><div>Just trying to make my own bold assertions falsifiable :)</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 6:32 PM, Monte Hurd <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;mhurd@wikimedia.org&#39;);" target="_blank">mhurd@wikimedia.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">The whole human-vs-extracted descriptions quality question could be fairly easy to test I think:<div><br></div><div>- Pick, some number of articles at random. </div><div>- Run them through a description extraction script.</div><div>- Have a human describe the same articles with, say, the app interface I demo&#39;ed.</div><div><br></div><div>If nothing else this exercise could perhaps make what&#39;s thus far been a wildly abstract discussion more concrete.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 6:17 PM, Monte Hurd <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;mhurd@wikimedia.org&#39;);" target="_blank">mhurd@wikimedia.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>If having the most elegant description extraction mechanism was the goal I would totally agree ;)</div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 5:19 PM, Dmitry Brant <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;dbrant@wikimedia.org&#39;);" target="_blank">dbrant@wikimedia.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>IMO, allowing the user to edit the description is a missed opportunity to make the user edit the actual *data*, such that the description is generated correctly.</div><br><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 8:02 PM, Monte Hurd <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;mhurd@wikimedia.org&#39;);" target="_blank">mhurd@wikimedia.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>IMO, if the goal is quality, then human curated descriptions are superior until such time as the auto-generation script passes the Turing test ;) </div><div><br></div><div>I see these empty descriptions as an amazing opportunity to give *everyone* an easy new way to edit. I whipped an app editing interface up at the Lyon hackathon:</div><div>    <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VblyGhf_c8" target="_blank">bluetooth720</a><br></div><div><br></div><div>I used it to add a couple hundred descriptions in a single day just by hitting &quot;random&quot; then adding descriptions for articles which didn&#39;t have them.</div><div><br></div><div>I&#39;d love to try a limited test of this in production to get a sense for how effective human curation can be if the interface is easy to use...</div><div><br></div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 1:25 PM, Jan Ainali <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;jan.ainali@wikimedia.se&#39;);" target="_blank">jan.ainali@wikimedia.se</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Nice one! <div><br></div><div>Does not appear to work on svwiki though. Does it have something to do with that the wiki in question does not display that tagline?</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div><div dir="ltr"><div><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><i>Med vänliga hälsningar,<br>Jan Ainali</i></span></div><div><font size="1"><br></font></div><div><font size="1">Verksamhetschef, <a href="http://wikimedia.se" target="_blank">Wikimedia Sverige</a> </font><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font size="1"><br>0729 - 67 29 48</font></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font size="1"><br></font></span><img src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/91/Wikimedia_Sverige_logo.svg/460px-Wikimedia_Sverige_logo.svg.png" height="97" width="94" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
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<br><div class="gmail_quote">2015-08-18 17:23 GMT+02:00 Magnus Manske <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;magnusmanske@googlemail.com&#39;);" target="_blank">magnusmanske@googlemail.com</a>&gt;</span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div>Show automatic description underneath &quot;From Wikipedia...&quot;:<br><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Magnus_Manske/autodesc.js" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Magnus_Manske/autodesc.js</a><br><br></div>To use, add:<br>importScript ( &#39;User:Magnus_Manske/autodesc.js&#39; ) ;<br></div>to your common.js<br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div><div dir="ltr">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 9:47 AM Jane Darnell &lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;jane023@gmail.com&#39;);" target="_blank">jane023@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><div dir="ltr">It would be even better if this (short: 3 field max) pipe-separated list was available as a gadget to wikidatans on Wikipedia (like me). I can&#39;t see if a page I am on has an &quot;instance of&quot; (though it should) and I can see the description thanks to another gadget (sorry no idea which one that is). Often I will update empty descriptions, but if I was served basic fields (so for a painting, the creator field), I would click through to update that too.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo) <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="javascript:_e(%7B%7D,&#39;cvml&#39;,&#39;nemowiki@gmail.com&#39;);" target="_blank">nemowiki@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Jane Darnell, 15/08/2015 08:53:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Yes but even if the descriptions were just the contents of fields<br>
separated by a pipe it would be better than nothing.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
+1, item descriptions are mostly useless in my experience.<br>
<br>
As for &quot;get into production on Wikipedia&quot; I don&#39;t know what it means, I certainly don&#39;t like 1) mobile-specific features, 2) overriding existing manually curated content; but it&#39;s good to 3) fill gaps. Mobile folks often do (1) and (2), if they *instead* did (3) I&#39;d be very happy. :)<span><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Nemo<br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div><span>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div></div></div><span>-- <br><div><div dir="ltr">Dmitry Brant<br>Mobile Apps Team (Android)<br>Wikimedia Foundation<br><a href="https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_mobile_engineering" target="_blank">https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_mobile_engineering</a><div><br></div></div></div>
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</blockquote></div></div></div></div></div><br><br>-- <br><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr">EN Wikipedia user page: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Brian.gerstle" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Brian.gerstle</a><br>IRC: bgerstle</div></div></div><br>