Hey,
1- Making fun of my English (which is not perfect I admit) is a little bit
unethical. Don't you think? I expected higher standards from this mailing
list
2- Situation of Iranian languages is a political issue, I definitely agree
but not this case. I was actually asked by the same person who started this
discussion in fa.wp who speaks Lurish. Is it okay for to make this Wiki
again with proper script? and I said, why not? that would be awesome. I'm
not like these crazy protagonists that think the only language in Iran is
Persian and other ones are its dialects. I definitely in favor of
re-launching this wiki with proper scripts that are readable by Lur people.
Not a handful number of people.
3- I think originality of this script is implicitly mentioned in email of
the professor, quoting: "There are some quirky orthographic things [...]
off of words, but many fewer issues than a lot of the other homemade
scripts I’ve seen used for Luri."
My attention came to word "homemade". Have you explained to him what
"originality" means in context of Wikipedia? I must explain to you: This
script is readable if the person knows Kurdish because the extra letters
came from ckb language but Kurdish and Lurish are two different languages
with different speakers with different ethnically backgrounds. please
explain the situation properly to him and ask if a normal Lur who was
educated in Iran, can read this script or not.
Best
On Mon, Feb 1, 2016 at 3:17 PM Oliver Stegen <oliver_stegen(a)sil.org> wrote:
In May 2015, I had contacted Erik Anonby, a Canadian
linguist with
specialty in Iranian languages, and he actually verified the contents of
lrc:wp (then still in the incubator). It was him who also provided contact
for Mehdi Moshkriz who is now maligned by fa:wp editors. [Btw, I do not
find Amir Ladsgroup's English much better than Mogoeilor's.]
I actually assume that this is a predominantly political issue, and I
would caution against allowing fa:wp editors to interfere in lrc:wp issues
- especially when we already have independent verification from a bona fide
Canadian (i.e. non-Persian!) scholar. I append his reply fyi.
-------------------------------------------------------------
from Erik Anonby's reply (May 2015):
"I know Bakhtiari and Southern Luri a lot better than Northern Luri – most
of my knowledge of N Luri is lexicon and phonology rather than whole texts.
But from looking at several articles, it looks well-enough written to me.
There are some quirky orthographic things (like splitting the –e “is” /
direct object suffix) off of words, but many fewer issues than a lot of the
other homemade scripts I’ve seen used for Luri.
The author is also using Khorramabadi dialect, which is the central
dialect but heavily influenced by Persian and not typical of the language
as a whole. He could still use this dialect but with a bit of accommodation
to the language as a whole; for example, it’s a bit of a shame he doesn’t
use Luri verb prefixes like present/continuous i- (which is used pretty
much everywhere other than in Khorramabad) rather than Khorramabadi mi-
(which is from Persian).
Two scholars who could verify the content (naturalness, spelling, etc.)
better than me are:
Sekandar Amanollahi (retired; I don’t have his contact info)
Mehdi Moshkriz (at Iranshahr University until recently; his email is [...])
Mehdi is very nice and could probably put you in touch with many other
Luri scholars, too, to check the articles."
On 31-Jan-16 9:02 PM, MF-Warburg wrote:
It's very embarrassing for us if that is true.
Is it possible that the language used is not Northern Lurish, but at least
correct Central L.?
Do we have any other contacts in the linguistic world who could help
verify it?
I agree that the wiki ought to be closed if it's not in a real language.
Am 30.01.2016 02:46 schrieb "Amir Ladsgroup" <ladsgroup(a)gmail.com>om>:
Hey,
Several days ago a discussion
<https://fa.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%D9%88%DB%8C%DA%A9%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D9%BE%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%A7:%D9%82%D9%87%D9%88%D9%87%E2%80%8C%D8%AE%D8%A7%D9%86%D9%87/%DA%AF%D9%88%D9%86%D8%A7%DA%AF%D9%88%D9%86&oldid=16528438#.D9.88.DB.8C.DA.A9.DB.8C_.D9.84.D8.B1.DB.8C>
has been started in Persian Wikipedia regarding Northern[1] Luri wikipedia (
lrc.wikimedia.org).
If I want to give you a summary of the discussion. Mostly they say script
is unreadable (it's greatly different than Persian script) and also they
noted that vocabulary is tried to be away of Persian (and close to Kuridsh)
in a bad way and thus it's un-understandable for people who talk this
variant of Luri (As it was mentioned this Luri is being spoken in
Khoramabbad and Broujerd, two big cities of Iran). We can confirm that we
showed this wiki to several people who speak Luri and in either Khoramabad
or Boroujerd. None of them could understand most of content of this wiki.
We also provided a big table at the discussion in Persian Wikipedia and
compared several words in the wiki to what they actually speak in Northern
Luri.
I found this <http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.org.wikimedia.langcom/150> in
which User:Mogoeilor told you that Gholamreza Mehramooz (User:Mehramooz) is
a university professor with PhD and interestingly when we asked about the
script in that wiki User:Mogoeilor (the same person) told us the script is
made up by a User:Mehramooz because he has MSc in linguistics (edit
<https://lrc.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%DA%A4%DB%8C%DA%A9%DB%8C%D9%BE%D8%A6%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%A7:%DA%86%D8%A7%D8%B3%D8%AA_%D8%AD%D9%88%D9%99%D9%86%DB%95/%D8%AC%D9%88%D9%99%D8%B1_%DA%A4%D8%A7_%D8%AC%D9%88%D9%99%D8%B1&diff=prev&oldid=26654>)
. More interestingly in his blog he says he has a MSc in translation
studies (published about a year and half ago
<http://www.zistrah.blogfa.com/post/16>) You can verify the blog in his
user page.
[1]: Also an interesting conversation
<https://lrc.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%DA%A4%DB%8C%DA%A9%DB%8C%D9%BE%D8%A6%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%A7:%DA%86%D8%A7%D8%B3%D8%AA_%D8%AD%D9%88%D9%99%D9%86%DB%95/%D8%AC%D9%88%D9%99%D8%B1_%DA%A4%D8%A7_%D8%AC%D9%88%D9%99%D8%B1&oldid=34935#.D9.84.DB.8A.D8.B1.DB.8C_.D8.B4.D9.88.D9.85.D8.A7.D9.84.DB.8C>
happened in this wiki in Persian. It seems they changed named of the wiki
from Northern Luri to Minjaii Luri "Minjaii" is a word in Luri that in
English means "Centeral Luri"
Best
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