It is impossible not to get upset. In my memory we worked to honor Alice Paul. She never saw the ERA pass. (and neither have I)
 It's is so soon in the history of the world that women have been able to vote.It has not even been 100 years in the U.S.

Of course they are scared. of course they are mean. equality is terrifying to them. so they do these kinds of things over and over and we fight back little by little...but each day another woman steps up on your shoulders and is carried to make an edit that changes their horridness.

it is a long slow fight.

I have been at it for years and years in the pre-Internet days and I drop out for months at a time. Then go back. Your work, Sarah  has been read by an entire class I teach and given much heart to many young women.
Don't give up.

On Mon, Apr 29, 2013 at 11:44 AM, anna jonsson <> wrote:
Emojifor your good work !!
Anna Jonsson

Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 08:29:40 -0700
Subject: Re: [Gendergap] Topless image retention on Commons and use on enwp

Sorry if this gets a little off topic from the actual focus of the subjects. I just need to personally vent and this gives me a chance (thanks Katherine). I assume I can't be the only one who feels this way, and it seems you might also. 

I totally understand the "it depresses me" situation. I got involved in some of the discussions about the women's foo categories only to get bombarded with comments when I brought up "I don't know if anyone here is even a woman involved, from what I know, I think I might be the only woman here," and then to be snapped at "How do you know I'm not a woman?" by someone with a male user name (Jeremy). I felt like a total fail, and basically left the conversation only to get comments on my talk page. I have officially declared I'm "burnt out" on any and all gender conversations, specifically triggered by the recent category situation. 

95% if not more of the people discussing all of these things are, from what I believe, identifying on Wikipedia as the masculine. It's really troubling for me, and right now I'm at the point where I just can't fight it right now. I'm feeling depressed about it, hopeless, and all of the other fun things that go with burn out. (Funny, I didn't suffer burn out this severe when I was a fellow, but I did have two minor bouts of burn out during that year, this is by far the worst)

I basically had to stop doing the painful nomination and arguing about nudity and women's images on Commons. Part of this was because it was so demoralizing and depressing, and the other was the repeated "You'll never be an admin on Commons if you keep doing this," and I always wanted to be an admin on Commons. The fact that I let this argument - being made by male Commonists - trigger me to not participate in the conversations is an entirely different psychological issue in itself! Oy vey. 

Gah. :( 


On Mon, Apr 29, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Katherine Casey <> wrote:
Came across this kerfuffle today. I'd love to see what more gendergap-focused people think about the following progression of events (note: the image is NSFW, but each of the links I'm providing are SFW if you don't click through to the image/article):
Speaking personally, my takeaway from reading through this situation has gone through "mortification in empathy for the image subject, who was almost certainly drunk and unable to consent", "frustration with Commons's dismissive approach to the questioning of identfiable sexual images", and finally "realization that in all three discussions, I see no users who I know to be female. Not one. It seems quite likely that the issue of whether this woman's right to be protected by BLP extends to images of her being discussed 100% by men."

I don't quite know what my point is here, other than to note that to me, this feels very, very representative of the way women and women's issues are treated on WP and on Commons, even when we're supposed to be hyper-aware of the gendergap and its effects, and it depresses me.


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Sarah Stierch
Museumist, open culture advocate, and Wikimedian

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