Honesty, I'm a little confused. It tells me that as of having an account I have established that these are three things that I can do, but I don't know what the 3 things under the icons are [the article links]. I still don't know what the [article titles] are. I would have to click, I assume they're blue so I can click on them."

Clicked through to MC Shan <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MC_Shan> article. "I forgot what I was supposed to do and the articles had changed in the list Getting Started list when I went back." Used browser forward button to return to MC Shan article. "Now I see that these are articles that have the copyediting tag. It appears to me now like it's randomly giving pages that have a need for the heading [fix grammar & spelling, but the link is not clear.

I wish the green pencil link was also present on the article [but the citation template does not use that icon]. The graphics and the language don't match between Getting Started and the article cleanup templates. I want to see the same icon and language.

I don't want to have to keep clicking back and forth to the getting started page. I want to participate but make the edit button more inviting. I'm kind of shy, but I'm close. If you just give me a little push I might participate. The Getting Started icons I like, they're great map markers. Make the 'you can assist by editing it' be green and have the same Getting started green pencil icon, maybe at a 45 degree angle like 'here, take it, try it'. Further suggestions: Have the user sandbox upfront on the Getting Stared page, and also the watchlist. "Those are engaging. Make them very easily accessible."

Hey folks, another interview, probably my last before moving on to usability testing the TWA script. This one also includes some feedback on Getting Started. --Jake (Ocaasi) You can edit: "I learned that is was a community based effort. It's that site every one can edit. I think is great...with many people looking at the same subject, you have a better change to get the length and breadth of the subject...the opportunity to look from various vantage points. It does credibility issues, but I notice there are checks and balances. It's a mild concern, a mild risk, not so much a concern for general information gathering--as a source I'd have more concern and want to verify it. Go to Wikipedia: Types in Wikipedia.org. "I'm Happy that it's high up in Google search results." Sign up for an account: "I would 'eyeball' the login info. I glanced at the username policy... I get that. Not going to add email now, maybe later. I am kind of protective about my email address. I'm concerned about Hacking and Phishing, through no fault of Wikipedia's, but I'm concerned Wikipedia could be a target. Captcha is not a concern, but it's an inconvenience, and we'll get past it one day with technology. Getting started page: "It's clean and clear on 3 points with color-coded icons. If I'm editing, these are functions of contributing... Honesty, I'm a little confused. It tells me that as of having an account I have established that these are three things that I can do, but I don't know what the 3 things under the icons are [the article links]. I still don't know what the [article titles] are. I would have to click, I assume they're blue so I can click on them." Clicked through to MC Shan article. "I forgot what I was supposed to do and the articles had changed in the list Getting Started list when I went back." Used browser forward button to return to MC Shan article. "Now I see that these are articles that have the copyediting tag. It appears to me now like it's randomly giving pages that have a need for the heading [fix grammar & spelling, but the link is not clear. I wish the green pencil link was also present on the article [but the citation template does not use that icon]. The graphics and the language don't match between Getting Started and the article cleanup templates. I want to see the same icon and language. I don't want to have to keep clicking back and forth to the getting started page. I want to participate but make the edit button more inviting. I'm kind of shy, but I'm close. If you just give me a little push I might participate. The Getting Started icons I like, they're great map markers. Make the 'you can assist by editing it' be green and have the same Getting started green pencil icon, maybe at a 45 degree angle like 'here, take it, try it'. Further suggestions: Have the user sandbox upfront on the Getting Stared page, and also the watchlist. "Those are engaging. Make them very easily accessible." Clicked edit on the MC Shan article [recommended by Getting Started], saw the editing page: "Oh god, you just scared me. Yikes, goodbye. Looks a little too code-y and like I might break something. Also, I'm not very connected to MC Shan. The curly brackets [header templates] are intimidating. I'm concerned about these double brackets, too. Do I need to know how to edit to contribute? I feel like I could copy and paste without breaking something, and that I might actually succeed. I feel like I could contribute to the [infobox] without breaking it. I want to make a contribution but I absolutely don't want to break something in a public space--it's like the motto, first, do no harm. It feels like there's limited places I might feel ok contributing: after = signs [in infoboxes], that seems really easy, next level is adding to a list by copying and pasting, and then, getting into the paragraphs--not so sure about that. I don't know what those double brackets are. I would have to commit my time to a learning curve that I'm not so passionate about, would determine whether or not I'd invest in learning it. I don't think they would set something up that was too easy to break, but I would expect that lacking double brackets wouldn't have the functionality. I don't know what all the apostrophe's are." Create your userpage: "I see I don't have a userpage, but it's giving me the option to start one. It's got this sort of blank text editor. Am I creating an actual article-like page, am I going to be indexed in the search? It says userpage but it's mildly confusing. I dont know what belongs on a userpage, maybe optionally qualifying yourself (as in credentials), more information about you and what your background is. I don't know what 'watch this page' means, and I don't want to get lots of alerts. "Oh, can somebody else make a change to my userpage... maybe I have to watch this page. So now I'm making a commitment, someone could write something about me. Made word bold, "Oh good grief. I wanted it to be WYSIWYG, I wanted it to turn bold. "I'm feeling like it's not very userfriendly, it's kind of geeky. I would be willing to overlook it if I was compelled about the information... I would overcome it." Tried to undo italics, instead it inserted double italics, then quadruple italics. Manually deleted the quotations. "It seemed a little 'literal'". Leave me a message: "I expect the talk page to have comments at the bottom, like an online article. I don't see a chat or message something. 'Talk' I would think... I don't know what that is. Talking is usually done over the phone, or in person. It doesn't feel like it has to do with written messages. I see conversation threads, I would expect to have an 'add' or a 'comment' function underneath the table of contents. I'm a little befuddled, a little lost. I'm looking for something that gives me an indication to Add something. I probably would go to the Help at this point. All it feels like I can do is edit an existing section....I don't think I want to add a new section... Edit is for something already existing." Told her New Section was the way. "I would change from 'New section' to 'New Talk'; 'section' makes it feel like I'm creating a whole new section. Creating a new talk page makes sense to me. Stick with the word 'Talk'.... I feel ok about signing my own post, but it would be a little more useful if it said 'sign your posts' near the signature button. I'm curious if it would prompt me to add a signature, but it doesn't prompt me. Hmmm... I wonder if in the preview it should indicate that the comment is unsigned. If signing is good practice, is there a reason you don't do it by default?" Add a sentence with a reference in your sandbox: Found 'Cite', then clicked [named reference]. "I'm feeling like I need a url". Even with a url named reference doesn't work. Had to do a captcha so it saved. Told her to use the template dropdown menu. Reference worked. Received a welcome message (unplanned): "I like it, I feel like it was standard issue, but I appreciate it." Informed it was an actual editor who did it. What would you change: "The obvious WYSIWYG. All the fundamentals are there. No more 'confetti of apostrophes'. It feels like to be a contributor you have to be a geek. It's just polishing stuff. I want to see more consistency and leveraging common terminology. There's a very inconsistent use of Create.Read.Update. and Delete [database functions you're trying to control]]. I see different function words like 'dismiss'. That's not a huge technological thing, just consistency about the tools you already are using, renaming, repositioning--bringing them to the forefront. You have to manage real estate, find the priority functions and present different ways to execute it (links, words, icons, tabs) in multiple different ways." --Female database designer from Philadelphia area, BS in communications, in her 40's, on April 11 2013. -- Jake Orlowitz Wikipedia: Ocaasi Facebook: Jake Orlowitz Twitter: JakeOrlowitz LinkedIn: Jake Orlowitz Email: jorlowitz(a)yahoo.com Skype: jorlowitz Cell: (484) 684-2104 Home: (484) 380-3940 _______________________________________________ EE mailing list EE(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/ee

On 04/12/2013 06:43 PM, S Page wrote: I agree. That's really key, so they understand which of their skills are transferable. The user page one may be kind of wiki-specific (due to stuff like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Userboxes). But I think we could do a general sandbox one (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=47200).

The real problem with the sandbox is that it gives no direction whatsoever about how to learn markup.

most use on the Sandbox would likely be not substantially different than a general "first edit" tour. I'd really like us to someday have a Sandbox with a REPL-like instructor for progressively harder markup, though VisualEditor perhaps makes this less of a priority.