Re: [Design] Living style guide

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Ryan Kaldari

31 Jan 2015 31 Jan '15

12:49 a.m.

The whole point of having a living style guide was to prevent the endless proliferation of outdated MediaWiki style guides (as we were creating about 1 a year for a while). Now we're somehow doing the same thing yet again. Is it really impossible for us to stick to a single style guide? On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 4:22 PM, MZMcBride <z(a)mzmcbride.com> wrote:

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Hi. Re: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Design/Living_style_guide This page is kind of sad right now. It references <http://tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide> pretty heavily, but my understanding from <https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T88036> is that <http://living-style-guide.wmflabs.org> is the actual style guide now? I'm not really sure and I'm worried that if I can't keep up, nobody else stands a chance! ;-) But really, we want to make sure everyone is discussing the same project. It would be great if someone more knowledgable than me (about the living style guide!) could update the wiki page and the description of <https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/tag/living-style-guide/>, at least with the best URL, if tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide is no longer it. MZMcBride _______________________________________________ Design mailing list Design(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/design

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Erik Moeller

31 Jan 31 Jan

1:06 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

This has actually been a long time coming, and will be the canonical LSG. It's built into MediaWiki, supports live controls and code snippets, and uses OOjs UI. There's still a lot of stuff missing and neither design nor content are final. With that said, we can do a better job proactively communicating the progress of this effort, deprecating old content, and keeping the wiki up-to-date. I would ask all members of the UX team to help with that. Erik -- Erik Möller VP of Product & Strategy, Wikimedia Foundation

Ryan Kaldari

1 Feb 1 Feb

10:04 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

I'm all for updating the style guide. But what I don't understand is why we have to keep setting up competing style guides in different locations. This does nothing but confuse people. On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 5:06 PM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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Jared Zimmerman

2 Feb 2 Feb

4:06 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

Ryan, we'll sort through and decommissioned all the other guides when we launch this one, any help tracking all of the ones out there in the wild is appreciated.

MZMcBride

4:57 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

Jared Zimmerman wrote:

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Ryan, we'll sort through and decommissioned all the other guides when we launch this one, any help tracking all of the ones out there in the wild is appreciated.

My goal at the moment is to get these two pages updated: * https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Design/Living_style_guide * https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/tag/living-style-guide/ We're a few replies deep in this thread and I still don't know where the One True Living Style Guide lives. :-/ Every instance of the living style guide's documentation should include links to the living style guide and its source code, in my opinion. There's too much confusion here currently and we want to (try to) ensure we're all talking about the same project. MZMcBride

S Page

3 Feb 3 Feb

1:56 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 8:57 PM, MZMcBride <z(a)mzmcbride.com> wrote:

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We're a few replies deep in this thread and I still don't know where the One True Living Style Guide lives. :-/

Yes it's confusing. The other discussion on the design list, in https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/design/2015-February/002246.html is helpful.

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My goal at the moment is to get these two pages updated: * https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Design/Living_style_guide

this now mentions both. I also edited https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/OOjs_UI to mention the MediaWiki theme in 1.25, and https://living-style-guide.wmflabs (Andrew, Prateek, Trevor, it's your call when to remove the "early draft" caveats.) The reality is some forms in core, 16 extensions, and an unknown number of on-wiki gadgets use the mediawiki.ui* modules, so IMO we shouldn't eliminate a fine generated demonstration of how it works. But we should be clear that going forward, using OOjs UI will be the way to UX consistency. (I'm still unclear about the timing of "going forward" and "will".) Every instance of the living style guide's documentation should include

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links to the living style guide and its source code, in my opinion.

I'm not sure what you mean, but that sounds right. More to do: * revamping https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki_UI , I've made a few edits already * mention OOjs UI in the mediawiki.ui LSG (gerrit patch to resources/src/mediawiki.ui welcome) Thanks for caring! -- =S Page WMF Tech writer

Erik Moeller

11:10 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 5:56 PM, S Page <spage(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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* mention OOjs UI in the mediawiki.ui LSG (gerrit patch to resources/src/mediawiki.ui welcome)

What's the source for the https://tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide/ landing page so we can make it not-awful if we're going to keep it around for a while longer while mediawiki.ui is still in use? Erik -- Erik Möller VP of Product & Strategy, Wikimedia Foundation

Ryan Kaldari

11:14 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 3:10 PM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 5:56 PM, S Page <spage(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

* mention OOjs UI in the mediawiki.ui LSG (gerrit patch to resources/src/mediawiki.ui welcome)

What's the source for the https://tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide/ landing page so we can make it not-awful if we're going to keep it around for a while longer while mediawiki.ui is still in use?

It's in the 'styleguide' project on tools labs, which is maintained by S, Prateek, JonR, and MattF. Kaldari

Prateek Saxena

9 Feb 9 Feb

11:55 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

Sorry for the late reply. On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 10:27 AM, MZMcBride <z(a)mzmcbride.com> wrote:

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My goal at the moment is to get these two pages updated: * https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Design/Living_style_guide * https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/tag/living-style-guide/

I updated these pages after S's initial edits. I added the technologies being used and the topics we are planning to cover. Is there anything else that I should add? On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 3:34 AM, Ryan Kaldari <rkaldari(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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I'm all for updating the style guide. But what I don't understand is why we have to keep setting up competing style guides in different locations. This does nothing but confuse people.

I don't think they are competing style guides, they are just different for different technologies (the mediawiki.ui LESS files and the MediaWiki theme in OOjs UI). They still have (or at least strive to have) the same design. The reason we setup a new one was due to the limitations of KSS. OOjs UI has JavaScript widgets that can't be documented with KSS. We also wanted to add non-CSS documentation like a primer on typography and iconography but KSS allows for only on Markdown file in the introduction, making it difficult to achieve this. I agree that it confuses people :( I hope documentation helps! I am happy to clarify anywhere else you might think it'll help. On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 4:40 AM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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What's the source for the https://tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide/ landing page so we can make it not-awful if we're going to keep it around for a while longer while mediawiki.ui is still in use?

Its not-awful now. —prtksxna

Erik Moeller

4:56 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Feb 9, 2015 3:55 AM, "Prateek Saxena" <psaxena(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 4:40 AM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

What's the source for the https://tools.wmflabs.org/styleguide/ landing page so we can make it not-awful if we're going to keep it

Its not-awful now.

Thanks for prettying it up a little. Could you make the following additional changes: - Add introduction: "This page describes the use of the mediawiki.ui styles available as LESS files in MediaWiki core. Longer term, the goal is to convert controls over to the use of <a href=" https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/OOjs_UI">OOjs UI</a>, which is a library available in PHP and JavaScript, and which supplies multiple themes, including a MediaWiki theme consistent with these styles. A living style guide based on OOjs UI can be found <a href=" http://living-style-guide.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page">here</a>… Obviously feel free to tweak the language if anything is inaccurate. - Remove the "Coming" section, unless there's relevant content (currently it leads to a 404). Ironically, the "mobile" section is currently not mobile-friendly. Is it still relevant? Thanks, Erik

Ryan Kaldari

7:14 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 8:56 AM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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- Add introduction: "This page describes the use of the mediawiki.ui styles available as LESS files in MediaWiki core. Longer term, the goal is to convert controls over to the use of <a href=" https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/OOjs_UI">OOjs UI</a>, which is a library available in PHP and JavaScript, and which supplies multiple themes, including a MediaWiki theme consistent with these styles. A living style guide based on OOjs UI can be found <a href=" http://living-style-guide.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page">here</a>…

I was about to suggest the same thing. Ironically, the "mobile" section is currently not mobile-friendly. Is it

...

still relevant?

Yes, this is still the primary style guide used for mobile development. I created a Phabricator task for the various style inconsistencies between mediawiki.ui and OOjs UI: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T88449. It looks like Prateek and May are already working on it :) Thanks guys! Kaldari

Prateek Saxena

11:23 p.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

- Add introduction: "This page describes the use of the mediawiki.ui styles available as LESS files in MediaWiki core. Longer term, the goal is to convert controls over to the use of <a href="https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/OOjs_UI">OOjs UI</a>, which is a library available in PHP and JavaScript, and which supplies multiple themes, including a MediaWiki theme consistent with these styles. A living style guide based on OOjs UI can be found <a href="http://living-style-guide.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page">he…

Done. Thanks Erik! On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

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- Remove the "Coming" section, unless there's relevant content (currently it leads to a 404).

S, do you know how these were being generated?

S Page

10 Feb 10 Feb

9:05 a.m.

New subject: Living style guide

On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 3:23 PM, Prateek Saxena <psaxena(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

...

On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Erik Moeller <erik(a)wikimedia.org> wrote:

- Remove the "Coming" section, unless there's relevant content

(currently it

leads to a 404).

I removed it. That was when Flow's UI was in advance of the styles in core.

...

S, do you know how these were being generated?

Adjust the files in the styleguide project on tools-login.wmflabs.org to build something different, copy the generated core/docs/kss/static/ somewhere, add a link to public_html/index.html I manually rebuilt the MobileFrontend KSS. The automated script needs a newer version of npm than is on tools-login, https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T89093 -- =S Page WMF Tech writer

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participants (6)

Erik Moeller
Jared Zimmerman
MZMcBride
Prateek Saxena
Ryan Kaldari
S Page