-1

Our "Desktop" site is not a mouse-only desktop site. It's served to all non-tiny devices. Including desktops with mixed Touch and Pointer support and large tablets that don't have a pointer at all and rely entirely on touch.

I do not find mouseover to be an acceptable thing to rely on.
~Daniel Friesen (Dantman, Nadir-Seen-Fire) [http://danielfriesen.name/]
On 2013-07-08 2:19 PM, Jared Zimmerman wrote:
I'm not afraid of a completely different structure on mobile that is more appropriate to touch devices, but on the desktop I think we can rely on hover as a means of interacting with the content. 

While space isn't as much of a concern the point of a gallery does feel more like it is about appreciating the imagery, by itself without extraneous elements clutter the visuals. When images appear in context they'll continue to have a byline with the title and author but in the gallery context this seems less desirable. Having the row of text breaking up the images feels distracting.

As with anything else we do we want the non-js version to be a graceful degradation of the experience. perhaps for non-js users we can set the text in white, on a black field, connected to the bottom of each image to make it seem like a cohesive object, and use similar typesetting, as the JS version, e.g. multiple font weights and opacity, left aligned, etc to echo the look and information hierarchy of the JS version, just not overlayed onto the images and having no rollover effect. 



Jared Zimmerman  \\  Director of User Experience \\ Wikimedia Foundation               
M : +1 415 609 4043 |   :  @JaredZimmerman



On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 2:06 PM, Jon Robson <jrobson@wikimedia.org> wrote:
I'd love to see this redesigned with mobile in mind as well... galleries are currently very broken on mobile!


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Matthew Walker <mwalker@wikimedia.org> wrote:
I was actually quite drawn to the images that were clean with no overlays until mouseover, it was also more closely tied to the look of the commons uploader mobile app. We feel strongly that consistency between these would be ideal.

Look and feel consistency is great; but I feel that the motivation for the dark overlay on mobile is driven by a lack of space. This lack of space does not exist on the desktop. We are an information provider; why are we advocating for hiding pertinent information about something if we have space to display it? Am I missing another constraint we've identified somewhere?

There's another problem with relying on mouseover... touch devices (which are a present and growing percentage of 'desktop' web devices) do not have a mouse to hover. What is our solution there if we go the hover route?

What about the case where the user does not have javascript enabled -- what is our progressive enhancement pathway?

~Matt Walker
Wikimedia Foundation
Fundraising Technology Team


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Jared Zimmerman <jared.zimmerman@wikimedia.org> wrote:
I was actually quite drawn to the images that were clean with no overlays until mouseover, it was also more closely tied to the look of the commons uploader mobile app. We feel strongly that consistency between these would be ideal.

I'd urge you to continue to explore a dark overlay on hover style for the desktop. 

May created the mockup here http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Commons_Web_Gallery



Jared Zimmerman  \\  Director of User Experience \\ Wikimedia Foundation               



On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 10:09 PM, bawolff <bawolff+wn@gmail.com> wrote:
Just as an update on my attempt to redesign the gallery tag. I now completed the code (Making it work well with TMH was more challenging than I expected).

Based on feedback, it seems like hiding of caption is not wanted, so I changed the default mode on the demo. In my patchset it add a "mode" parameter to the gallery tag that users can select.

Ideally what I would like to see happen with this is that it gets CR and is merged (but the default is still the old gallery), let the users play with it for a little while. If feedback is positive, switch it to be the default (for both the <gallery> parser tag, and things like categories, Special:newimages, etc).

The code is at: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/67885/ (Sorry for a somewhat big patch). Any code review (or other types of review/feedback) would be appreciated. There's also a patch for TMH at https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/69455/

Thanks,
Bawolff



--
- Brian
Caution: The mass of this product contains the energy equivalent of 85 million tons of TNT per net ounce of weight.


On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 2:53 PM, Jared Zimmerman <jared.zimmerman@wikimedia.org> wrote:
I tried this new version on my phone first and my desktop browser just now, a little feedback

- I like it
- May our Visual Designer is working on an information overlay for use in the commons mobile apps, I'd like for the visual design to sync up with that work, which should be done in a few days
- Animation! I think this is a perfect opportunity to use some animation, we still want this to be quick, but having the overlays animate in(very fast), and out(less fast) would be ideal.



Jared Zimmerman  \\  Director of User Experience \\ Wikimedia Foundation               



On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 9:02 PM, bawolff <bawolff+wn@gmail.com> wrote:
> I like the overall look, couple notes:
> * Think about tablet and mobile views -- galleries are even awfuller on
> mobile right now than on desktop. This means a) consider touchscreens and b)
> consider small screens.
> * I'm not sold on "show title on hover". Touchscreens don't do hover...
> * Ragged edges can be fixed by adjusting spacing or aspect ratio a little,
> like justifying text. This would look awesome. :)
> * We need to fix what happens when clicking the items -- should get a nice
> zoomed lightbox or something. This should be shared with non-gallery media
> however, so can be outside this present scope.
>
> Another related thing to consider is Category page gallery displays...
> having a gallery-style display for contained media is relatively easy, but
> how can we show subcategories nicely? What about non-visual media? Can we
> display them better than we do now?
>
> -- brion


So I've tweaked the demo a little bit in response to feedback:
*If you're on a touchscreen, it will always show the caption instead
of hover. Screen readers should also always see the caption, and if an
image receives focus, its caption becomes visible.
**Nonetheless, hover seems to be a sticking point, so I have a bunch
of non-hover variations at
http://tools.wmflabs.org/bawolff/gallery/index.php?title=Main_Page
(May have to scroll)
*Javascript now justifies the images. (The page is loaded with 1.5x
the normal resolution images, and the <img> tag is manipulated to try
and fill everything up, up to a maximum of 1.5x the original size. The
last row is left as is, since its often a single image [Although as I
write this, I think it should be manipulated too, might as well make
it 1.5x]). As an aside, I found out that if I do text-align: justify,
the browser will adjust the whitespace between images to justify it.
However I think it looks better with the last row centred and
typically adjusting the image size is enough; the whitespace doesn't
have to be touched.
**If you resize the browser window, js doesn't re-adjust stuff
currently, so ragged edges re-appear. I suppose it could. Would make
things a bit more complex

> Another related thing to consider is Category page gallery displays...
> having a gallery-style display for contained media is relatively easy, but
> how can we show subcategories nicely?

There was a thread a while back on the commons village pump which I
thought was an interesting idea, where some users wanted a magic word
that would enable a gallery view for subcategories, where each
subcategory has a representative image specified via some means (I
imagine parser func on subcategory page), or if unspecified defaults
to the first entry in the subcategory.

Thanks everyone for the feedback :D

--bawolff

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