Hoi,
from a database point of view this is gibberish, you cannot model this,
Thanks,
GerardM
On Wed, 30 Jun 2021 at 00:18, Philippe Verdy <verdyp(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I'm a bit confused by the difference taken between
the base "Lemma" and
the MANY "Senses" it could have. Normally, each lemma has a SINGLE sense
and a standard/base form. Some lemmas could have several forms
(orthographic), while keeping its single sense. Each sense however may have
restrictions on its forms depending on context/sentence (e.g.
capitalization) but this also applies to the lemma.
May be the term "Lemma" just refers to a dictionary entry which may
exhibit several related senses (with minor semantic difference, meaning
that the lemma also has the same set of possible translations to the same
target language: note however that some lemmas may not have any
suitable translation into a single lemma in the target language, where an
expression could be needed, and each translation will depend on the forms
and context of use or usage where one or several lemmas from the source
language may map to one or several target lemmas in the target).
But I don't see how separating senses from lemmas will offer any help, it
is in my opinion an extra and unneeded layer of complexification.
Are there good counter examples ? I can't imagine anyone (unless lemmas
are ill-defined: if you refer to a dictionnary entry, it is just an
editorial choice from a specific dictionnary).
May be this is just an informal group of related senses but it is highly
debatable and depend on each author: some authors may create entries by
level of language, or jargons/terminologies/context of use (e.g. legal,
commercial, vulgar/vernacular, scientific in specific domains), and such
grouping is generally evolutive (even from the same authors) and subject to
lot of personal perceptions and interpretations...
So we should make things more simple: merge Lemas and Senses into the same
entity type (1-to-1). The only difference I see is in the set of forms for
the same lemma, which may be euivalent (with just one prefered in some
contexts, such as abbreviated forms, slangs/alterations/simplifications or
just forms that are always considered as equivalent (e.g.
indetermination of accents, proposed orthographic reforms, historic forms
that fell out of use...)
Now there's the special case of contextual mutations (generally for
phonetics or harmony, including some unwritten parts, such as rules for
contractions, elisions and liaisons in French that change how surrounding
terms are written or modified outside the written (or spoken, or gestured)
form of the lemma itself., or the insertion of non-semantic phonetic
particles (like [-t-] or [z'] in French)
Le mar. 29 juin 2021 à 18:31, Andy <borucki.andrzej(a)gmail.com> a écrit :
All these tools are planning to do or some tools
are written? How to
help? how to write sample tool? (Python?,JavaScript? Php?)
Is possible bot to mass import lexems? for example from Wiktionary?
Now user can freely add sense for example to
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Lexeme:L7006 from Wiktionary?
How download only lexicographic data from WikiData? A year ago I download
huge amount data - 100 GB zipped,
wt., 29 cze 2021 o 17:30 Thad Guidry <thadguidry(a)gmail.com> napisał(a):
In the SVG for Lexeme Data Model
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Lexicographical_data/Documentation#/media/File:Lexeme_data_model.svg>
we do a great job showing what is possible. We just need better placeholder
forms in those tools
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Tools/Lexicographical_data>,
and I'd say instead of a Tool, a new Gadget or two that can automatically
expose those placeholder properties for easier manual entry based on a
user's preference of what parts of the Lexeme data model they typically
want to work on. Adding synonyms, senses, or sets of properties often used
together, etc. as in your use case.
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