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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">We need to come up with a neutral, timeless name for the war</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">in Iraq. Forgive me for the length of this post, but I</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">believe it's important enough to warrant your attention.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">I object to the incessant labeling of the war in Iraq as</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">the "invasion of Iraq". There is a lot more to the war than</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">the fact that 2 or 3 countries have invaded it.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Regardless of our personal feelings about how right or wrong</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">the conduct of any nation in the war has been, the</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">*articles* should:</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* have neutral content</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* have neutral titles</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Let me lay my cards on the table, so you don't</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">misunderstand. My church opposes the US campaign: Bush was</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">wrong to attack. I agree with that POV. Many others do,</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">also, although perhaps not for precisely the same religious</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">reasons as Rev. Moon.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">However, even though I'm "right" about my POV and most</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Wikipedians happen to agree with me...</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">WE ALL AGREED TO ADHERE TO JIMBO'S NEUTRAL-POINT-OF-VIEW</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">POLICY</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Excuse me for shouting, but several of us have been</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">confounding neutral-point-of-view with other things. I'm not</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">naming names and not engaging in prolepsis or other Roman</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">rhetorical tricks. I just want to fix the problem, so let's</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">all pitch in, please.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">The war started in 2003, and it's taking place in Iraq</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">(which is near the Persian Gulf), so we might call it:</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* the [[2003 war in Iraq]] or [[2003 Iraq War]]</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* the [[2003 Gulf War]]</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">There are various military campaigns. I know of 4 countries</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">fighting against Iraq (the "allies" or "coalition"). We</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">should write about the war from the standpoint that there</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">are two sides in the war:</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* Iraq</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* US, UK, Australia & Poland</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">(I might be wrong about Australia or Poland; if so, that's</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">an important detail and please correct me.)</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">(There might be other countries which are parties to the</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">conflict. Maybe Iraq has a military or other ally which I</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">don't know about; if so, we should write about that ally!</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">There are up to 4 dozen countries in various degrees of</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">opposition to Iraq, and we've begun an article or two on</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">them.)</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Also, I think "coalition of the willing" is a purely</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">political phrase: propaganda, i.e., a slogan. I don't think</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">it makes a good title for either of the following topics:</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* the countries which oppose Iraq in the 2003 war, or</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* every country which has made a statement or taken action</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">FOR OR AGAINST IRAQ</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">The latter topic, especially, would be just plain stupid to</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">call [[coalition of the willing]] because by design it</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">includes opponents.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">I started dividing the [[coalition of the willing]] article</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">into:</FONT></SPAN>
</P>
<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* a short article about the slogan "coalition of the</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">willing"</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">* a longer article, tentatively called [[US-led coalition</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">against Iraq]]</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">But the "...coalition" article lists every nation in the</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">world which has ever made a statement or taken action on the</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">war. Roughly, there are around 2 or 3 dozen nations ranged</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">against Iraq (in word or deed) and maybe 5 dozen speaking up</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">for them or providing aid.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Shouldn't we have an article which lists the positions of</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">each nation of the world on this war? If so, what should we</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">call it? How about [[national positions on the 2003 war in</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Iraq]]? Can we think of a shorter or more accurate title?</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">I hate to keep taking discussion off the talk pages, but</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">this is the only central place I know of, and talk gets</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">fragmented and overlooked too easily when discussing</FONT></SPAN>
<BR><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">multiple articles.</FONT></SPAN>
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<P><SPAN LANG="en-us"><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Ed Poor</FONT></SPAN>
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