<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Yes, the traditional usage has been predominantly masculine, but in
modern usage, "they" is the dominant form. See my reply at
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Gender-neutral_language#She_before_he.3F">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Gender-neutral_language#She_before_he.3F</a><br>
<br>
Ryan Kaldari<br>
<br>
<br>
On 12/28/11 4:50 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAP9+R958mtQD29ir8QTfntRZLf+d8w+mwwpVMMR0qty3mizeQA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">On Thu, Dec 29, 2011 at 6:06 AM, Ryan Kaldari <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rkaldari@wikimedia.org">rkaldari@wikimedia.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
I responded to the inquiry and replaced all the gendered
pronouns at<br>
issue with singular they. On a related note, I'm very
disappointed to<br>
learn that the Chicago Manual of Style (which provided the
basis for the<br>
original Wikipedia Manual of Style) has stopped recommending
the use of<br>
singular they. As the use of singular they has been steadily
increasing<br>
since the 1960s (Pauwels 2003), it is curious that the Chicago
Manual<br>
would be moving backwards. I have to wonder if there was some
sort of<br>
political pressure involved. On a positive note, the 2011
edition of the<br>
New International Version Bible now uses singular they.</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And I defended the reverting editor. (<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk%3AGender-neutral_language&action=historysubmit&diff=468184170&oldid=468179760">http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk%3AGender-neutral_language&action=historysubmit&diff=468184170&oldid=468179760</a>).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It's an interesting topic, but the original editor seems to
be taking a political stance, which the reverting editor might
not know about. The usage of Generic Antecedents,
by definition require the gender to be unknown or irrelevant.
The traditional usage has been predominantly masculine. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I am not a native English speaker so I might be wrong on
this, but the article is using Generic Antecedents.
The approach taken in English language has certain usage
hard-wired in the brain. There has been a long standing
argument about the political undertone about its usage (<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generic_antecedents#Political_opinions">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generic_antecedents#Political_opinions</a>). </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>What Kaldari did, while ideal to avoid any conflict or
debate, is debatable in the grammatical sense. The usage note
in Dictionary.com (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/they">http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/they</a>)
and other sources (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/26/magazine/26FOB-onlanguage-t.html?_r=2">http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/26/magazine/26FOB-onlanguage-t.html?_r=2</a>)
dispute usage of "singular" they as a gender neutral singular
pronoun rather than a plural pronoun. The usage note mentions
"This <span id="hotword" style="background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: verdana;
text-align: left;"><span id="hotword" name="hotword"
style="">increased</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">use</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">is</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">at</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">least</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">partly</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">impelled</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">by </span><span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">the</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">desire</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">to</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">avoid</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">the</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">sexist</span> <span id="hotword"
name="hotword" style="">implications</span> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">of</span> </span><span
class="sc" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
display: inline; font-variant: small-caps; color: rgb(51,
51, 51); font-family: verdana; text-align: left;"><span
id="hotword" style=""><span id="hotword" name="hotword"
style="">he</span> </span></span><span id="hotword"
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(51,
51, 51); font-family: verdana; text-align: left;"> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">as</span> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">a</span> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">pronoun</span> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">of </span><span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">general</span> <span
id="hotword" name="hotword" style="">reference."</span></span></div>
<div style="text-align: left;"><font color="#333333"
face="verdana"><br>
I'm sure Dominic can correct me if I'm wrong on this one. </font></div>
<div style="text-align: left;"><font color="#333333"
face="verdana"><br>
</font></div>
<div style="text-align: left;"><font color="#333333"
face="verdana">Regards<br>
Theo</font></div>
</div>
<pre wrap="">
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
_______________________________________________
Gendergap mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org">Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>