[Foundation-l] Wikimedia mouvement

[Florence Devouard]

Michael Snow wrote:
> Florence Devouard wrote:
>> Hardly.
>>
>> Meta is mostly a work-environment. Transforming it to be a rather public 
>> site would damage its own current role.
>>
>> WikimediaFoundation wiki would fit that role better. However, there is 
>> much more to the Wikimedia mouvement than just the Foundation.
>>
>> Currently, we do have a private wiki playing that role. That's 
>> internalwiki. The new site would simply be the public version of internal.
>>   
> I'm not especially clear on what the boundaries are here. Meta is a work 
> environment, I suppose, but it's also public in various senses. Most 
> notably, right now, it's the place where information about the board 
> election is presented. What damage do you envision this doing to Meta's 
> current role?
> 
> My inclination is to view Meta, much like Commons, as a project 
> primarily to serve the rest of the larger movement. That means it may 
> end up hosting a mixture of things, depending on what is needed. These 
> areas may still develop a distinct community of their own, but I'm 
> concerned about a tendency to exclude matters from their scope when they 
> have legitimate value to the movement and no other obvious home. 
> Deletionism is tricky enough in our projects whose scope is more clearly 
> limited.



> Opening up wikimediafoundation.org to more people, in conjunction with 
> flagged revisions, is another possibility that's been suggested a few 
> times. That may be good, although I agree it may not be sufficient and 
> this is broader than just the foundation. But I'm not sure about the 
> value of throwing more wikis at the issue, be they public or private, 
> freely editable or more limited.

Given that I was the one who originally suggested that it would be a 
good idea to open wmf editing thanks to flaggued revisions, I am not 
going to say it is a bad idea.

However, considering wmf site as the official hosting of information 
regarding all of our organization would be a huge mistake.

A website should never have two different roles, in particular when 
roles may be conflicting with each other. That would be really looking 
for trouble...

WMF needs to control its editorial content as it is a corporate website. 
It can not accept personal essays from non wmf members if the personal 
essay conveys a message not consistent with wmf agreed public message.
Chapters are often much more politically involved than WMF, involved in 
lobbying, in such a way that might be unacceptable to WMF. Results might 
include
1) frustration from chapter who want to post something but get moderated 
by WMF staff;
2) loss of time for WMF staff who needs to understand (sometimes 
translate) a text from a chapter before validating its publication;
3) conflicting messaging
4) feeling of submission of chapters toward WMF

I am pretty sure it would not work. Two proofs being the following 
pages, opened by Jay for public participation from chapters
* http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_room/Media_Contact_2008 (to 
post contacts made with the press generally)
* http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_room/Speaking_2008

I can wait a couple of months and come back to you in september to show 
you how these pages evolve if you wish ;-)
I am quite sure these pages will never be populated. Either because the 
chapter do not track such information. Or because it will be a 
duplicated effort with a page already existing on the chapter website.
Or because chapter people will fail to see what their interest is in 
providing this effort.

-------------

Could this be hosted on meta ?

Yes, certainly. At least for a while.
But again, the role of that new site would be different from the role of 
meta and this might enter in conflict, in particular with regards to the 
main page.

meta main page is meant to be super practical. Can you figure out a 
visitor coming to meta to understand better what wikimedia is, and 
finding this page ? http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
Please take a step back and try to figure out what all these funny 
little words mean for the layman ? CheckUser queries ? SUL ? 1.13alpha 
(r35980) ? Sandbox ? Babel templates ?

Versus a main page stating in a few words, "what is wikimedia ?"
With links to the following pages
* pressbook and press releases
* is there a wikimeet soon in your area ?
* conferences were wikimedia people are present this month ?
* do you want to buy a wikimedia tee-shirt ?
* is jimmy wales coming to your city in the next 5 years ?
* events organized by wikimedia people this year
* Wikipedia on DVD. Which languages ? Where to get them ?
* etc...

Sure enough, all these pages could be hosted on meta. But navigation 
might get very confusing given that it include all other pages on meta. 
At a minimum, we need a separate main page that would be editable.

But I would imagine that this futur website will not only (or simply) be 
a wiki in the future. Other technologies might make sense as well.

---------------

Would it be a duplication from current chapter websites ?

Yes, in part. So it is necessary to avoid duplication as much as 
possible. However, I feel that the recent meeting in Netherlands seemed 
to imply that chapters and wmf felt there was not enough cooperation and 
sharing between organizations. A common public website is a beginning of 
an answer toward more "cooperation" and coordination.

I may be too early in proposing this and you guys are not ready in your 
mind. That's okay. I'll let it sink nicely and will come back in a few 
months. There is no hurry.

Ant